MSB, SJW, and other acronyms

[Rucket]

@templari said in MSB, SJW, and other acronyms:

I'm going to be as short as possible in my response that I will probably be forced to regret.

I feel that it has been made abundantly clear on this forum, unless one is left leaning in nature, they should keep their mouths shut. Regardless of topic. If you try to speak otherwise, the dogpile will come.That if you are a moderate, or right leaning, you're simply not welcome here.

That. Is exactly how this place has made me feel.

I'll use this as a place to openly admit that I'm a filthy fucking centrist.

[Apos]

@templari Like I get that dog piling sucks and someone probably doesn't need 8 different people all telling them they are terrible or whatever but it depresses me beyond measure that 'please don't use slurs if I ask you to stop' is considered a political stance.

[Templari]

@apos Thanks for proving my point.

[Apos]

@templari But it's just not a political view. I'm a moderate and it would even be a stretch to say I'm center left on a lot of issues. It makes me uncomfortable when people make trump jokes outside of the political forum. But whatever man, if you say being polite or showing like basic courtesy to people falls on the hard left then I dunno what to tell you.

[Templari]

@apos You continue to prove my point, by continuing to link anything not left of center as supporting slurs. That slurs must equal a political view. My post has NOTHING to do with that. At all. However, you made that assumption. You're the first, you won't be the last.

[Apos]

@templari But you're literally posting on a thread about slurs saying that pushback against saying slurs makes you feel uncomfortable as a moderate, when I'm a moderate and think that is dumb. So I mean, if you're not saying that, it's kind of off topic, no?

[faraday]

@apos said in MSB, SJW, and other acronyms:

@templari But you're literally posting on a thread about slurs saying that pushback against saying slurs makes you feel uncomfortable as a moderate, when I'm a moderate and think that is dumb. So I mean, if you're not saying that, it's kind of off topic, no?

Is this topic specifically about slurs? It sounded like it was more about potentially-hot-button topics in general. That's how I read it anyway. I wasn't following the thread that originally spawned this one so maybe there's more context that isn't being provided.

[Apos]

@faraday Yeah sorry for context it started from the hogpit because someone got called a cunt and then lectured on it about social awareness and called SJW back and so on, basically what you'd expect.

[Templari]

You can claim what you want to claim to be. But I also do not see you calling anyone out above for being 'off topic'. Like I said. I feel very unwelcome. I took this post to be referencing free speech.

[Doozer]

@templari said in MSB, SJW, and other acronyms:

I'm going to be as short as possible in my response that I will probably be forced to regret.

I feel that it has been made abundantly clear on this forum, unless one is left leaning in nature, they should keep their mouths shut. Regardless of topic. If you try to speak otherwise, the dogpile will come.That if you are a moderate, or right leaning, you're simply not welcome here.

That. Is exactly how this place has made me feel.

@templari said in MSB, SJW, and other acronyms:

@apos You continue to prove my point, by continuing to link anything not left of center as supporting slurs. That slurs must equal a political view. My post has NOTHING to do with that. At all. However, you made that assumption. You're the first, you won't be the last.

I'm absolutely confused now. Like I have a curve in my spine that goes right or we talkin about political leanings? Which nation's politics? What does left center and right mean?

[Tehom]

@templari said in MSB, SJW, and other acronyms:

You can claim what you want to claim to be. But I also do not see you calling anyone out above for being 'off topic'. Like I said. I feel very unwelcome. I took this post to be referencing free speech.

Is free speech by others making you feel very unwelcome? If so, what would be your suggested solution?

[Auspice]

@insomnia said in MSB, SJW, and other acronyms:

There are streams where people just eat. Nothing else, but eat.

I discovered that the Asian grocery near me has an amaaaaaaazing selection of ramen and noodle bowls and briefly debated a YT channel where I review one a week.
<.<

[Insomnia]

I mean in all honestly, I see SJW as a slur. Well slur is probably strong. I honestly get wanting to make change, and make things better for people, but the people who have adopted the title, the vocal minority of assholes have ruined it. Kinda like how the Swastika was a luck symbol, I don't understand why people would willingly say they are a SJW after most people view it so badly. So yeah for me, if I ever were to call someone an SJW it would be meant as an insult.

[deadculture]

I'd just like to point out that since it's hard to define 'moderate' as pertains to political stance due to geographic (as @Shincashay), continental (as in, American vs European spectrum) and ideological differences, it might be best to define exactly what you're a moderate in versus just claiming you're a moderate.

In a society that is mostly defined along ideologies and stances mostly defined by socialism, for instance, you'd get anarchists and classic Marxists on the hardest left, Trotskyists and Leninists on the harder left, democrat socialists on the middle of the road and neo-liberals along with social democrats on the right.

So it might be good to just explain in what ways you're middle of the road, and what ways you lean one way or another.

(minor edit)

[Apos]

Well it's kinda like if there was a thread debating about like, whether holocaust denial was protected speech and then someone chimed in saying the board was too left leaning and unfriendly. I mean. It might be. They might have a point. But that's a really, really weird place to bring it up that has some uncomfortable associations. That's an extreme example but I hope you can see what I'm getting at and why I'm like, 'whoa hold up buddy, that's not really a political thing' to me. Obviously slurs are nowhere near as bad but like, I just don't think that's a political thing.

[insomniac7809]

@insomnia said in MSB, SJW, and other acronyms:

I mean in all honestly, I see SJW as a slur. Well slur is probably strong. I honestly get wanting to make change, and make things better for people, but the people who have adopted the title, the vocal minority of assholes have ruined it. Kinda like how the Swastika was a luck symbol, I don't understand why people would willingly say they are a SJW after most people view it so badly. So yeah for me, if I ever were to call someone an SJW it would be meant as an insult.

This is veering off topic, but... I call myself an SJW because a) the sort of people who use SJW as an insult are the sort of people I'm quite content to be insulted by, for the most part, and b) it's fucking awesome. Seriously. A warrior of justice. That's a fucking superhero. Why would I be insulted because somebody wants to call me a superhero?

[deadculture]

@apos Yeah, I see what you mean.

I think the stances in that particular debate are "words are just words" and "slurs are words that, when used, in any context, cause harm."

But I can agree 100% with your point that political leanings don't have much to do with what we're discussing so much as whether moderation for those words needs to be active or simply left as-is (ie. there is a rule about no homophobia/racism/discrimination, etc. in the rules of the forum) and we leave the things that fall beyond the scope (such as the usage of some words people find unpleasant) as "legal gray area", in the way that I see it.

I think, preferably, we might want to not open the political can of worms.

(PS: while holocaust denial is protected speech in the US, you get jail-time in about 90% of the other countries that are signatory to a certain UN Convention on Human Rights. On the other hand, I am a long time admirer of the almost-absolute sanctity of freedom of speech in your country. It defeats the point of the real crazies out there when they're allowed to say their things and can be dismissed out of hand, versus censoring them and then they have that as confirmation bias to point out to others that might be susceptible to the siren's call of political violence.)

[Ganymede]

@tehom said in MSB, SJW, and other acronyms:

Is free speech by others making you feel very unwelcome? If so, what would be your suggested solution?

This feels like a bait-and-switch question.

I agree with Templari, but I will point out that Tyche still hangs around and that motherfucker doesn't shut the fuck up about his point of view. Which I appreciate because, you know, some of us just don't shut the fuck up about how we lean, myself included.

Flying off the handle seems to be the way that the world works, lemme tell you what. I don't know what that opposing counsel wanted when I calmly told him my offer to settle, but it sure didn't make me want to work with him any more.

I don't like being called an SJW. That term, to me, is dismissively pejorative. And I'm not the best, recent example of not being inflammatory for the sake of rhetoric, but if we all tried to lean in that direction, it'd be a nice culture shift.

[deadculture]

@ganymede There are times your lawyer mode is never switched off and it can grind my lawyer gears a little bit, and then there are times I find your posts insightful and a bit funny.

Also since I think I need to address that edit: SJW, like 'right-wing nutter' and 'antivaxxer' and 'gun nut' are all labels. Labels, unfortunately, are words we often weaponize so we're able to hurt our ideatic debate opponents, especially when things get heated. Ultimately, nothing good results from using them, since they're meant exclusively to disrupt a speaker's chain of thought so we can engage our own.

[Ganymede]

@deadculture said in MSB, SJW, and other acronyms:

There are times your lawyer mode is never switched off and it can grind my lawyer gears a little bit, and then there are times I find your posts insightful and a bit funny.

Lawyer mode is usually on because I post from work. It's a bad habit.

I'm funnier and more insightful when I've had a couple of bourbons, like right now.