Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.

[Auspice]

@Tinuviel said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

Hey I have an actually relatable Real World Irk today!

If, after a discussion or argument, I change my mind or concede the other person's point I am not back-peddling. I am changing my mind. The entire point of speech is to convey information to another person, and the entire point of a discussion or argument is to educate the person you're conveying information to to change their mind.

That's not me back-peddling, that is me taking in new information and changing my mind. That's how it's supposed to work.

Nope.
You just fell into one of the greatest blunders of the internet.

YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO DEFEND EVERY IDEA TO THE DEATH.
Even the wrong ones.
especially the wrong ones

[Macha]

Grr. This may work up to RL anger, but right now I'm just super annoyed. Our lease renewal showed up in March. I did not have my name listed as a lease holder, and I did not sign it, because everyone in the house knew I want to move out (with the new ouch auto immune stairs suck, and climbing two flights of stairs to pee and shower is painful). I find a new place I love, fill out all my information...and then the office manager for my current townhouse says No, you're stuck in the lease. Even though you didn't sign it, and even though your name is absent from the list of lease holders.

I am not pleased. I find this super sketchy and negligent on her part, for not noticing I DID NOT sign it.

[Auspice]

@Macha said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

Grr. This may work up to RL anger, but right now I'm just super annoyed. Our lease renewal showed up in March. I did not have my name listed as a lease holder, and I did not sign it, because everyone in the house knew I want to move out (with the new ouch auto immune stairs suck, and climbing two flights of stairs to pee and shower is painful). I find a new place I love, fill out all my information...and then the office manager for my current townhouse says No, you're stuck in the lease. Even though you didn't sign it, and even though your name is absent from the list of lease holders.

I am not pleased. I find this super sketchy and negligent on her part, for not noticing I DID NOT sign it.

If your name isn't anywhere on the lease.... there's nothing she can do legally, I'd assume?

[Macha]

@Auspice She says because I signed the original lease, I'm still considered a lease holder. Which doesn't SOUND right to me. I'm trying to reach the local legal aid office, but their hold times are long.

Another part of the problem is she states that I'm stuck, and the complex I applied at, is run by the same management company. So... yeah. Rough.

AND she states the other two original lease holders would have to release me, pay a 20.00 requalifying fee and requalify to live here.

[Alamias]

@Macha said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

Another part of the problem is she states that I'm stuck, and the complex I applied at, is run by the same management company.

You may try going over her head to the management company. Since they are run by the same one, they are not 'loosing' any income, so they may be able to work something out and/or transfer the lease?

I don't know, just offering a suggestion to look into.

[Macha]

@Alamias I appreciate the thinking. I had not yet thought that far (At work and annoyed. Blerg)

[surreality]

@Macha Definitely request a copy of the documents. If you know you didn't sign it, you can literally point to this as fact when you have them.

[Sparks]

@Alamias said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

You may try going over her head to the management company. Since they are run by the same one, they are not 'loosing' any income, so they may be able to work something out and/or transfer the lease?

I don't see that they'd be losing income anyway. Does the lease even change cost if one person moves out? Because I'd assume not. Sure, the individual residents would need to pay more (because obviously X divided Y ways is smaller than X divided Y-1 ways), but I'd assume the amount actually paid to the landlord per month doesn't change?

@Macha said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

AND she states the other two original lease holders would have to release me, pay a 20.00 requalifying fee and requalify to live here.

This is the one place I can see a semi-rational motive for her behavior: if you were the determining factor in the lease being granted—if without your credit report or whatever, the lease wouldn't have been approved—I can see her panicking a bit over not noticing you hadn't signed. Because if the others can't qualify for the lease on their own, then if you move out she technically shouldn't let them keep renting, at which point she does lose the income.

I still don't think she has a leg to stand on; I can see how she might be able to argue that you should've already moved out if you were no longer a signatory to the lease, but I can't see how she can reasonably argue that you have to stay after having not signed.

I mean, this is weird anyway; a rental contract shouldn't be like an unbreakable adamantium chain. Things happen. People lose their job. People get a different job and need to move. People have sickness or illness in their family and need to leave the state to return home and care for an ailing parent. Etc.

Sure, pretty much every time I rented in the past there was a penalty fee I'd have to pay if I broke the lease early, but it wasn't like the landlord was standing on the edge of a volcano, hands clasped behind their back, cackling in a voice of doom "I OWN YOUR SOUL AND YOU ARE NOW TRAPPED IN MY SERVICE FOR ETERNITY."

I mean, who the heck are you renting from here? Darkseid? Sauron?

[Alamias]

@Sparks said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

I don't see that they'd be losing income anyway. Does the lease even change cost if one person moves out? Because I'd assume not. Sure, the individual residents would need to pay more (because obviously X divided Y ways is smaller than X divided Y-1 ways), but I'd assume the amount actually paid to the landlord per month doesn't change?

True. I was just thinking that she is staying within the same 'company' so they might be able to work with her. shrug

[Roz]

@Macha said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

Grr. This may work up to RL anger, but right now I'm just super annoyed. Our lease renewal showed up in March. I did not have my name listed as a lease holder, and I did not sign it

This is the even more important part: that you weren't listed on the lease either, not just that you didn't sign it. Obviously all state laws are different, but when I was moving out of an apartment and my roommate was staying, the management company taking my name off the lease renewal document so that it only had my roommate's name was literally how they processed that. So I'm gonna guess they're not gonna have much legal ground here. Is the claim here that you didn't give them notice you didn't want to renew and just went with it when they erroneously didn't include your name?

[Too Old For This]

@Sparks There is a distressing trend that's started growing in some areas of the country where an apartment complex will charge you not only a fee for breaking your lease early... but you will also owe them the 'remainder' of the rent on the lease. Which is really just disgusting since the main reason people break a lease early is because they can no longer afford the rent and have to move somewhere cheaper. This largely shows up in the low income/poor areas, too, making it doubly nasty as they're the people least likely to be able to afford such a penalty.

[Macha]

okay, so when we originally set up the lease, they lumped the three of us into an account. My name is on that account. I'm looking at the renewal form, and there are two areas. Renewal, non renewal. Under renewal, my two roommates signed. I did not. But I did not sign under non-renewal either ( I never even SAW this document, I was dealing with my father's death because we got this in late Jan/Early Feb). So I don't know what, if any, options I have, other than deal with this bs, pay the 20 bucks and try to get out. (My one roommate makes more than enough on his own to qualify)

[Auspice]

@Macha said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

okay, so when we originally set up the lease, they lumped the three of us into an account. My name is on that account. I'm looking at the renewal form, and there are two areas. Renewal, non renewal. Under renewal, my two roommates signed. I did not. But I did not sign under non-renewal either ( I never even SAW this document, I was dealing with my father's death because we got this in late Jan/Early Feb). So I don't know what, if any, options I have, other than deal with this bs, pay the 20 bucks and try to get out. (My one roommate makes more than enough on his own to qualify)

I'd call the management company and explain 'Hey, my roommates signed the renewal part of the document and I didn't get the chance to read/sign the non-renewal section. How should I proceed?'

[Macha]

@Auspice I did send a message to the management company direct from their site. So, here's hoping.

[Ganymede]

@Macha said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

She says because I signed the original lease, I'm still considered a lease holder. Which doesn't SOUND right to me. I'm trying to reach the local legal aid office, but their hold times are long.

If there has been no official termination of your prior lease, you may be considered a lease holder even if you aren't actually living at the location.

Consider the following situation. You, Auspice, and Roz sign a 1-year lease for a piece of residential property. It expires on March 31, 2019. On March 30, 2019, Auspice and Roz execute a renewal of the lease, but you do not. Auspice and Roz continue to pay the lease. If you are found living at the property, can the landlord evict you?

In most jurisdictions, the answer is no. This is because: (1) the prior lease was never terminated; and (2) the current tenants are still paying rent. The landlord did not terminate the prior lease, nor did anyone else. This makes you a form of holdover tenant, who arguably may owe Auspice and Roz a portion of their monthly rent. Regardless, the landlord at the moment has no grounds to evict you even though: (1) you did not sign the renewal; and (2) you may not even be living there.

Practically speaking this is fixed easily. All you should have to do is execute a written termination of your prior lease, or send something in writing indicating your abandonment of the lease, with the return of your keys. You have thereby returned possession of the property to the landlord, which effectively terminates your lease de facto. The landlord should have no problem with that.

Also, practically speaking, I don't see why the landlord would not want a new tenant at a new location paying money on a new lease. They are making a bad business decision.

Anyhow, there you are. Stupid, I know.

[Macha]

@Ganymede I never got a key, so that's not a problem. I mean.. I can literally write something up saying I am abandoning the lease as of XYZ date, and that terminates the lease? And yeah, they can make an extra grand a month if I go to the new place.

[Ganymede]

@Macha said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

I never got a key, so that's not a problem. I mean.. I can literally write something up saying I am abandoning the lease as of XYZ date, and that terminates the lease? And yeah, they can make an extra grand a month if I go to the new place.

Technically speaking, you are supposed to give a period of notice before terminating a lease. The issue here is that the lease was renewed for the other tenants, so you're basically only giving notice of your termination. (You'll want to make that clear.)

If the agent you're talking to is being obstinate about the situation, though, I would escalate immediately. The property manager is just supposed to lease property, not make legal determinations as to whether someone is or is not a tenant at a particular unit.

[Macha]

@Ganymede I can't even get into the new place until July, so giving notice is not an issue.

[Ganymede]

@Macha said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

I can't even get into the new place until July, so giving notice is not an issue.

Oh, okay. Then I'd make sure the landlord knows you are going to the new place as of July <whatever>.

[Macha]

@Ganymede So I sent a message to the management company, asking for someone to contact me. It went right to the office bitch. Who proceeded to email me and talk down to me about if I 'needed it explained better, I could come into the office" - she knows I work a longer shift, and she is gone before I clock out. So I called her. She's now getting her supervisor in touch with me. AKA I told her that since I had not signed the renewal, and my roommates KNEW I had not, I do not need their permission to be released from said lease. I need to submit in writing my intention to terminate for me and me alone, on xyz date.