Well, this sums up why I RP

[Auspice]

@Kestrel said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

Good Omens was written by two very talented authors and is largely from the perspective of two very enjoyable characters. I don't know how exactly they sat down and wrote it together, if they took turns giving each character a voice or what, but the finished project, which was collaborative, is spectacular and fun, and definitely feels like it contains elements of each author's usual flair and style.

I once worked with a guy who is a good friend of Gaiman's. Coraline was written, largely, at this guy's house. Gaiman mentioned him a few times on his blog back before he switched primarily to Twitter.

Aaaaaaaanwyay. Good Omens was one of the only times, from what I gathered, those two got to actually sit down and collaborate on something. They were very good friends, but their lives kept them from seeing one another very often. This guy told me a story once about a con (back in the days when nerdy conventions were still a very niche thing and authors didn't always have 'handlers' and very strict schedules and...) where he found out both of them were there. He said he grabbed Pratchett and led him over to Gaiman and just... sat back.

He told me seeing those two together was one of the most inspiring, enjoyable things for him.

[Auspice]

@Ghost said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

@Kestrel said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

Tangent: I will gladly join @Ghost in launching a campaign to burn the played-by trend at the stake. Finally someone said it. Write your fucking descriptions, people.

<3.

It's a very simple way to be a better writer. Each character is its own little writing project to showcase your ability to flesh out the character using your skills as a writer.

I always feel like "PB over description" is a missed opportunity to actually treat the hobby like it's a writing hobby.

I wanna read, god damnit. Tired of seeing all these actors and actresses and want my mind to make new faces.

I don't mind PBs and would prob still use one. I hate writing descriptions. I hate how static they are (which is why I pose my character's current appearance in near every scene). I hate trying to convey in a succinct way what my character looks like. I hate how, pre-PBs, some people were so obsessed with being the PRETTIEST that their descs became purple prose filled blocks of text that you could barely navigate and often described some horrendous inhuman thing because they lost the plot midway through but could only continue forward with their thesaurus-abusing narrative.

I'm happy to have PBs.

[Kestrel]

@Auspice

EDIT: I forgot what I was actually going to say here, lol.

I grew up on Terry Pratchett novels, so his death actually hit me in the feels. I told someone at the time and they were like, 'what, because a celebrity died?' I wanted to smack them.

Gaiman's written a lot about his friend Pratchett and it's always a good read. While I know little about their collaborative process, I think their friendship is a cute story in and of itself, complete with compelling, relatable, flawed and wonderful characters.

@Auspice said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

I hate how, pre-PBs, some people were so obsessed with being the PRETTIEST that their descs became purple prose filled blocks of text that you could barely navigate and often described some horrendous inhuman thing because they lost the plot midway through but could only continue forward with their thesaurus-abusing narrative.

Contrast: I loved reading bad descriptions. And while I'm glad roster characters are helping more people dive into new games they may be unsure they're willing to commit to yet, I sometimes hate not being able to know if I'm RPing with a roster character or something this person made, because if I don't know they made their own character then it's harder for me to make a quick, snap decision on whether this person is worth my time.

Hate me, judge me, call me an elitist. The fewer barriers there are for players to quickly trip up and wave those red flags nice and clear for me to see, the better I can manage my time.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@Ghost If you put that forum up I'll definitely join it. I don't consider myself particularly guilty of the sins you list, but you're dangling a forum for people who write and mush, I mean, you had me right there.

On the PB thing, I have to admit that I am enough of a writing snob that I write my description first, then sketch-doodle something that matches what's in my head. I'm no great artist but I did work in the graphical design industry for a decade and I can sketch out a recognisable face. I just can't... do actors. They'll always come with associations that aren't mine, stories that aren't mine, words that aren't mine.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@Kestrel Neil Gaiman and Terry Pratchett took turns writing a scene and emailed it back and forth, I believe I've read Pratchett saying. So not really all that different from writing long poses on a code that allows time delays, such as Ares' web interface.

[Caggles]

@faraday said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

The story thread on BSG:Pacifica was pretty cool, IMHO

Yeah, but some of it was still just about Roan's precious hair - the big story is great, but the little stories can be the things that make the game for you.

[Roz]

@L-B-Heuschkel said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

@Kestrel Neil Gaiman and Terry Pratchett took turns writing a scene and emailed it back and forth, I believe I've read Pratchett saying. So not really all that different from writing long poses on a code that allows time delays, such as Ares' web interface.

I actually believe they might have MAILED chapters back and forth. Gaiman's definitely written a bit about their process.

[Auspice]

@L-B-Heuschkel said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

took turns writing a scene and emailed it back and forth,

I imagine mailed back and forth for two reasons:

1. Gaiman is well-known as handwriting his work until it's ready for the editing process.
2. While email did exist in the 80s, it was not widely/readily used yet.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@Auspice True, the book was released in what, 1990? It probably was snail mail at that.

Now that's the kind of dedication I need my RP partners to show in slow pose scenes. XD

[Darren]

Dammit. I upvoted @Ghost twice in the same thread. This is a dangerous precedent

[faraday]

Some novels are really really awful. Some RP is really good. Not NYTimes bestseller good, but still "good enough I'll go out of my way to read it" good.

Quality is not related to medium.

And even though MU writing is not the same as novel writing, you can use MUs to practice certain aspects of the mechanics involved because they share a common core.

@Caggles said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

Yeah, but some of it was still just about Roan's precious hair - the big story is great, but the little stories can be the things that make the game for you.

Lol yeah. But even Roan, shallow hair-obsessed dude he could be sometimes, had a story arc.

[mietze]

@Kestrel people do not always take rosters because they are "unsure and uncommitted", sometimes it is an avenue to take a PC that is known to be thematic and appropriate to the setting or even needed/wanted skillset. It allows you to avoid irritating people on a channel asking what's wanted or making a PC to try and fill other people's wants and then dropping/never finishing them because interest is lost or the oc creator gets pissed because someone else makes a similar concept and they are not uniquely desired anymore. Or cluttering up a who/character list with a shitload of many PCs that realistically you know will not be played after about a month and the newness wears off.

Not that it can't happen with rosters too, but unsureness and noncommittal is a player thing that many people who turn up their nose at pre-gen pcs often have in spades as well.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@faraday I think that attempting to judge the quality of mush writing is a dangerous path, to be honest. We roleplay for the entertainz, after all -- not to meet critical acclaim. I try my best to write concisely and use all muh wordz but I am very well aware that I flounder into purple prose, I use the same verb twice in one pose, I make all the mistakes. I do in my first drafts too, but there I have the luxury of going back and editing. Mush poses don't have the structural support to survive a meeting with a literary editor.

That's one of the places where mush writing and novel writing differ dramatically. One aims for instant gratification in the here and now and to hell with a typo or a repeated verb. The other aims for perfection and goes through five edits to get there. In the end, the novel will have the better prose (one should hope!).

The only kind of judgement that's really fair to pass on mush prose is whether it was entertaining to write and to read, which is a very personal thing. I monitor some characters' scenes like a hawk because they do really interesting stuff; their prose may not pass the Hemingway test but hot damn, they can tell a story.

[Auspice]

@L-B-Heuschkel said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

That's one of the places where mush writing and novel writing differ dramatically. One aims for instant gratification in the here and now and to hell with a typo or a repeated verb. The other aims for perfection and goes through five edits to get there. In the end, the novel will have the better prose (one should hope!).

I never edit my poses (unless I'm STing and then they get a pass for clarity).
My professional writing gets bogged down by the internal editor.

That's part of why I enjoy MUing, tbh. I can send the internal editor home for the day and just write.

[Ghost]

@Darren said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

precedent

Key word

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@Auspice said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

I never edit my poses (unless I'm STing and then they get a pass for clarity).

I do sometimes if I am writing a long pose for a scene I'm doing at snails' pace with someone on the other side of the planet where we write maybe 500-1000 words in turns. Then I have the time and can be bothered to get the words down just right.

In regular posing where I am playing in real time I only go back to fix things if the meaning is decidedly unclear. Maybe a blatant, glaring typo. "We ate him" is, after all, not the same as "we hate him".

[mietze]

You can be a great writer and suck at being a mush player or vice versa (I think the publishing success of quite a few infamous mushers should speak to that). Or maybe you can be good at everything!

But when it comes to mushing I will take someone who maybe wouldn't pass every test for stellar writing on the internet, who might mangle some grammar or structure now and then but who is a fun ooc collaborator and not an asshat over someone who is a great writer but consistently or frequently selfish and mean.

I can enjoy authors who are dicks because I do not have to deal with them on an individual level unless I want to. I like many works whose authors I have no desire to interact personally with, and the authors do not even have to be alive for me to connect with their work.

Which is the real difference between mushing and writing I think. It is a lot more personal and social, even when there is not a lot of chit chat, because of the responsiveness (or not being willing or capable to do that) to other people's writing that is expected.

[Ghost]

@L-B-Heuschkel said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

I monitor some characters' scenes like a hawk because they do really interesting stuff

Sidebar: I was always really disappointed by just how many scenes never got logged or posted. I have been of the opinion that if it happens in-game, then it should happen on-camera. I dont care if it's TS or two characters complaining about a third. I actually enjoyed reading some logs; it was something I would do from time to time while on break at work.

I did this because I genuinely liked some characters and their style, and feel that an environment supportive of posting logs and praising people for their creative efforts would do the hobby well.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@mietze This, pretty much. I don't mush to read perfect prose. I mush to hang out with other people who like words and storytelling. And I judge their behaviour not on the quality of their prose but on how they treat other human beings -- if I want perfect prose I've got a book shelf.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@Ghost said in Well, this sums up why I RP:

Sidebar: I was always really disappointed by just how many scenes never got logged or posted. I have been of the opinion that if it happens in-game, then it should happen on-camera. I dont care if it's TS or two characters complaining about a third.

I am of the firm opinion that almost everything should be posted and then readers can decide for themselves what parts they want to read. I'll contend that at least some games prefer to keep a PG13 website, and that should be respected. Apart from that, though, let me decide what parts of the story I want to read (unless you're really boring, that's probably going to be all of it because like @Ghost, I read logs while taking a break).