Regarding administration on MSB
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@thenomain said in Regarding administration on MSB:
@bored said in Regarding administration on MSB:
@thenomain I mean, damaging only on the scale of any of this shit being anything which anyone takes remotely seriously, which is a... very low scale, yes.
And yet, here we are.
if we're going to have 'active mods' (which I categorically object to as a major and harmful shift in the board culture) they need to post better than 'useless at best.'
So your summary of Auspice is 'useless at best'. Which means that you think her average is 'below useless', with no more evidence than "it looks bad if you don't trust them to begin with".
No, sorry. My 'useless at best' is for the quality of that post alone. IE you can scale it from 'not harmful but literally accomplishes nothing because the people who are accusing these things won't read it or care' (ie, useless) to 'maybe slightly harmful because its an official post that looks like spin/denial, and... I dunno, maybe someone who didn't know about MSB could get pointed at it by an angry staffer and believe them' (ie, fractionally negative).
Overall, I think we have two examples of @Auspice modding poorly. Based on this, if they want active mods, I think she's a bad choice so far. But I don't actually want active mods, and as a purely mechanical/workload mod I would have no particular issue.
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Double sorry
@wolfs said in Regarding administration on MSB:
Some of this reads more like people who have a personal problem with Auspice just looking for an excuse to gripe,
FWIW, I don't believe I have any particular history with her. Like @tempest, my focusing on her is because... she's the mod who's been fucking up. It really is that simple.
or some people just being against any form of visible moderation whatsoever.
This is closer to it. I'm not against any moderation, but I believe we were sold a rules-centric form of moderation but are instead getting mods (or at least, one of them) who are mod-voicing their opinions/ideas/etc. Do not want.
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@bored Well, I don't have an issue with someone telling people not to fuck with a game. Whether that comes from someone speaking as a regular poster or as a mod, it doesn't matter to me.
I maintain that there are more important things to get one's panties in a bunch over.
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You people wanted mods and now you've got them. As a red-blooded American, I will never understand the desire to want authority over my head, but it's not like MSB being modded will ever stop me from being the asshole that I am so it affects me in almost no way whatsoever. Why some of you are going for @Auspice's head I do not know, so far she's done nothing so egregious as to warrant this pages-long debate over her fitness to mod, but posters gonna post. I'll say this though, the same as we say about any game in any other thread - if you don't like the staff, leave.
Tinuviel about 9 hours ago
I hate you with the power of a thousand Pandoras. -
@bored By the way, I find this whole thing to be a ridiculously flimsy reason to accuse a moderator of fucking up over.
You disagree with a choice Auspice made. That does not equate to her fucking up.
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@pandora said in Regarding administration on MSB:
As a red-blooded American, I will never understand the desire to want authority over my head
I'll say this though, the same as we say about any game in any other thread - if you don't like the staff, leave.
Okay, go ahead.
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@surreality eh. If I have to sit through people screaming about ts sluts ruining a game every few months for fucking years, or people invoking the omg you are a horrible person if you do/don’t allow secret staff alts or omg someone is licking someone as a greeting on channel or omfg is it spider or anyone who does/doesn’t want social stats to mean anything in a game or who likes/does t like systems where they are ic coercive must be a lame-ass unable to handle anything bad happening to their pc wimp/rapist wannabe ad nauseum...
I don’t think conversation for a few months about a radical change in moderation is either all that repetative or even alarming.
It is the nature of a discussion board that repetative threads come up. At least major discussion takes place in one on this subject with burps now and then elsewhere.
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@wolfs Eh. If it was the first offense, I'd agree with you.
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Across how many threads and months and months was there constant discussion about how RfK players were unilaterally the devil/how dare any place not incorporate x from RfK slapfights? Which wasn’t particularly fun for us non-harassing but still sad ex-players either. I mean...it happens. Upsetting/uncomfortable/boring rehashes happen here. Like all the ducking time. Perhaps we should take it as a sign people actually care and have a lot in common because this is a remarkably people thing to do.
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It's worth note that not everyone agrees there's any offense here in the first place. If there was universal agreement on that front, this would be an entirely different conversation.
Oh fucking well.
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@bored Except this isn't really even an offense at all. She did nothing objectionable. She said "Don't harass games." She didn't say "Don't harass games or else." If you think that's what she said, that's what you're reading into it.
If you seriously consider this some sort of moderator offense, you need to re-evaluate a few things.
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@surreality also worth noting that it’s very rare that anyone agrees at all on anything here. Even who/what constitutes bad actors.
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@mietze Exactly. Which is why insisting it's a 'second offense' is putting forth opinion and claiming it as universal truth/fact. I'm just not even a little bit down with that.
Oh fucking well.
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@surreality i don’t see your point. You disagree, that’s great, but no more not-subjective than someone who does see two offenses. Or more. I don’t understand the argument here. You’re tire of seeing people complain about this, I get it. But that doesn’t mean that universally that’s the standard for people shutting up any more than you should be told you can’t be personally annoyed by it. And it doesn’t make people feel the way they feel less strongly to hear someone else say it’s stupid. Not sure that ever works for anyone.
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@mietze Yes, but the message a couple people are trying to send here is that Auspice fucked up and got another strike because someone simply dislikes moderation of any form beyond moving a few posts around to another sub-board in the background as needed.
People are used to zero moderation whatsoever and there's a bit of a push against it now that things are changing a little bit, perhaps as if they fear it's going to lead to further moderation and tighter rules when Arkandel himself has already made it pretty clear that's of no interest to him here. This sort of nitpicking over what Auspice did also shows little faith in Arkandel's ability to handle things himself, whether the people pointing the finger of blame here realize that or not.
I get that people want the freedom to say and do just about whatever they want here. The thing is, I don't see that suddenly being denied them. There are still some general standards of decency we should agree to in or out of the Hog Pit itself. "Don't go fuck with a game because you have a problem with someone, and don't use this place to try to set it up if you're not going to be deterred" is one most, if not all of us, seem to be in agreement on.
So why is reminding people of that such a problem, even if it's pro-active and based on something apparently said in private as a heads-up? It's like it's less about the reminder itself and more about the voice Auspice used to deliver it. Are we going to be THAT sensitive about it any time "MOD VOICE" comes up? Really?
The story would be completely different if Auspice went off on her own and openly threatened people with this or that if they didn't do as she demanded. That...did not happen. It didn't even come close to happening.
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@mietze Saying 'this is the second offense' is one thing. Claiming action must be taken based on that statement? That's only reasonable if the initial claim is actual fact. It's not; it's an opinion, and not justification for action any more than any other opinion.
ETA: Also note, I'm not telling Bored to shut up anywhere. I said that if his opinion was an agreed upon fact, the conversation people would be having would be different. That is pretty much the antithesis of telling somebody to shut up.
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People can say whatever they want. It doesn’t make anything happen, only one person can do that, and he’s been plain, IMO,on both situations I’ve seen discussed here. So does it matter any more than people who won’t stop criticizing a play style or something someone else likes? No, unless it shows that truly that person is upset about it/concerned about it and you know what to expect from them on that subject.
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@surreality said in Regarding administration on MSB:
@miss-demeanor said in Regarding administration on MSB:
You aren't the only one that sees the not-so-subtle correlations between staffers who are acting in ways that they would ban people for on their own games. Its being noted with high amusement.
Consider this thirded emphatically.
General note: it's seriously annoying to see the board explode in a fit every time the mods do something, and it does. It's almost always the same handful of people complaining, and honestly, at this point, I wish they'd make their own forum, moderated in their preferred fashion, rather than dragging this one into the proverbial toilet of 'argue about every single mod action for pages on end'.
This seems rather “shut up” to me, but perhaps I misread.
Because again, every time on other subjects brought up we do seem to rehash the same stories and reactions and gnashing of teeth almost verbatim.
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@wolfs said in Regarding administration on MSB:
People are used to zero moderation whatsoever and there's a bit of a push against it now that things are changing a little bit, perhaps as if they fear it's going to lead to further moderation and tighter rules when Arkandel himself has already made it pretty clear that's of no interest to him here. This sort of nitpicking over what Auspice did also shows little faith in Arkandel's ability to handle things himself, whether the people pointing the finger of blame here realize that or not.
I mean I could handle things myself, but I don't want to. What's even more important, you (all) don't want me to.
The whole point of having conspirators, other of course than sharing the workload, is that I wouldn't be the single authorit-ah around here. I want Ganymede's NUKE'EM FROM ORBIT approach, not because I usually agree with it but because I don't. I want Auspice's empathy and viewpoint because when left to my own devices I really have few shits to give, and that requires a counter.
We are not a hivemind - by design. We are different people. We see things differently. That's okay, it's MSB in a nutshell; with how many of you have I disagreed with in all sorts of topics, on all kinds of issues? How many of you were mad at me at some point? Because I assure you, there have been several who've made me squint over the last few years.
I don't expect or want us to be a kumbaya-kind of forum. That's not who we are. All I want is for us to be able to disagree vehemently with each other and still be able to coexist. In that way and no other I don't want this place to be my-way-or-the-highway; we're not a MUSH. To me the ability to stick together even when we don't like each other very much is the reason this place exists.
- He who takes offense when not intended is a fool. He who takes offense when intended is a greater fool.
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@mietze Oh, ffs. That was not addressed to Bored or his comment in any way, shape, or form.
If you want to stretch a generalized expression of frustration to be 'OMG SURREALITY AND HER MONSTROUS SILENCING TACTICS', have at, but it's ridiculous. "I wish this general thing would happen" is not the same as "this must occur due to this specific thing" and you're really reaching to make them equivalent.
Oh fucking well.
