@de-villefort Matches Malone would definitely hang out at a bowling alley though.
@de-villefort said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
I realize Clark Kent could go to some random gala as a reporter and Bruce Wayne could show up at a random bowling alley in Gotham to hang out with the plebeians... but why...? Why would you want to role play that?
The person you are presenting yourself as is a lie. The person the other players characters are presenting themselves as is also a lie.
You both ends up talking about meaningless stuff with people you know you're never going to have any real connection too because you're lying to their face and all you can hope to get out of it is a chance to arrange to meet them again to talk about more meaningless stuff while you continue to lie to each other.
Why bother?
... why both--
lol. Why am I surprised. You have a very, very limited concept of what is worth roleplaying so everything makes sense now.
@de-villefort said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
I realize Clark Kent could go to some random gala as a reporter and Bruce Wayne could show up at a random bowling alley in Gotham to hang out with the plebeians... but why...? Why would you want to role play that?
The person you are presenting yourself as is a lie. The person the other players characters are presenting themselves as is also a lie.
You both ends up talking about meaningless stuff with people you know you're never going to have any real connection too because you're lying to their face and all you can hope to get out of it is a chance to arrange to meet them again to talk about more meaningless stuff while you continue to lie to each other.
Why bother?
As I noted this reads as the other half I pointed out. This is not a MU issue. Batman and Superman know each other in the comics. This is a player issue, you don't want social RP is how this reads.
I'm still gonna play out this exercise from my stand point. So here are some reasons to bother:
1: In your player plots, some baddy is in the city sabotaging galas, you're both making notes to track suspicious activity to get a lead the LuthorCorp or something.
2: The last 4 scenes were just +combat, you're tired of it. This could be a decompress from helping Green Lantern in another galaxy. If you two get a moment to talk you can discuss how to help monitor the Lanterns sector such that it doesn't take you away from earth and try to put that into play with the rest of the justice league.
3: You're tired of combat. This is a time to be human a little and rediscover what you're fighting for.
4: Its an open event, Dr. Pamela Lillian Isley is there, its not revealed yet she is Poison Ivy. Wayne Foundation donated money to some of her research, she's being honored. Its a great chance to build character story arcs so that in a few weeks when she brings down half the men in the city and you go to deal with it, there is this reveal --- You! You were so nice at the gala and here you are doing your villainy! Curses! (Yes, in a story it plays out way better for this switch reveal if there is story before it not hand waving).
5: Meet any number of folks for same reason as number 4, build story so that in a fight it means more in the story
6: Clark the disguise of Superman thinks the Bruce the disguise of Batman is just that and they play some cat and mouse to try and out each other. Clark tests Bruce's reflexes, Bruce pulls out his secret Kryptonite stash to see how Clark reacts.
7: Just to RP and see what comes from it. I know there is a push to arrange plots and ideas, but on the other shoe, its fun to see how they develop. Maybe Clark player doesn't know Hal player, so they can meet see how interacting is and then plot some Green Lantern Superman crossover even.
8: You're playing a feature, you need to be accessible to other players, help them with stories. Maybe there isn't a Jimmy Olson but some other reporter, it gives them a chance to know Superman's alter ego before they know the truth of who he is (again, story build up is better than wave the hand reveal). Some random non-superman villain wants to know the supers and play with them to build some trust to come up later to Superman player with idea for a plot to foil.
9: You're character development. Clark Kent passing as human is pretty big in all superman stories and movies. Don't hand wave character development. We're RP'ing to tell stories together, if you want a game, check out gaming consoles and computers that let you play superheroes where you get to constantly do the ass-kickery.
10: I could keep going. If you really don't want to do most of this, I'm curious why play on a MU* which involves writing and development and interaction between players.
@de-villefort said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
I realize Clark Kent could go to some random gala as a reporter and Bruce Wayne could show up at a random bowling alley in Gotham to hang out with the plebeians... but why...? Why would you want to role play that?
The person you are presenting yourself as is a lie. The person the other players characters are presenting themselves as is also a lie.
You both ends up talking about meaningless stuff with people you know you're never going to have any real connection too because you're lying to their face and all you can hope to get out of it is a chance to arrange to meet them again to talk about more meaningless stuff while you continue to lie to each other.
Why bother?
My WoD characters do not generally talk about what they are. Talking about being a 'vampire' or 'Changeling' or whatever the choice is not something that should ICly be coming up in casual RP so it is not lying. My characters have developed solid relationship with people that trust is built up on. Not talking about something big like some special hook that is not branded about doesn't fall into 'lying'. Unless it is a couple and the person is not aging or something why would this 'secret' be talked about like talking about the weather?
Also, why wouldn't Clark Kent talk with someone casually? In the movies and comics he kind of goes 'Hey! What's going on?' to a random person. Sure, he could do his super thing and find out but he opts to interact with people. Batman has his rich playboy persona as a big part of his life. He's constantly in places where he can talk to people as someone who seems basically useless. He learns a lot of what is going on that way, with his 'coffeeshop RP'.
I feel like you're making the 'secret' the OMG most important aspect of the character and ignoring everything else about them. A Sin Eater is more than the person who deals with ghosts and the Underworld. The Noblewoman who can light things on fire with a touch because that is a special thing she can do is more than an arsonist. They have personalities, families, hobbies, etc. Why not focus on learning about the character (Much like you do in RL when you meet someone and you connect) over about their 'special' thing.
Do you walk up to some stranger and go 'I was abused as a child. Has anything like that happened to you?' in RL? So why would you go up to someone in a game all 'I'm a Changing Breed, a horse. Are you a supernatural being too?'?
I am aware it is not as point blank as that.
To sum it up.. if you make focusing on a person's secret your important thing for RP, anything else will never entertain you because the finding the secret is all you are presenting yourself as caring about. The people have offered so many suggestions and ideas to what could be used to create interesting RP.
I'll add some suggestions:
There is literally countless things that you could RP about that is not someone's 'secret'. Honestly, unless it is important to RP.. I really don't care what a person's secret is (Sometimes it is). I mean it is fun to be a person 'in the know' about someone's thing but it is not make or break to told when it comes to RPing with the person.
@icanbeyourmuse said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
A more fighty type? As suggested over hear plans of a mugging or potential murder or whatever and go be heroic and try stopping it with your friends. Train with your buddies, discuss the latest combat techniques. (I don't know much about combat stuff so best I can do)
Not to add more reasons why to go the gala/social event. But this here. Both supers are not familiar though in the comics they end up on the same team. This moment where you're both in your mundane identity and something happens in front of your face - how do you stop it, do you out your secret or do you find another clever way to stop it. Not just the show up later in disguise after overhearing, but literally if you two seem to get along during the social event, move to something happens that tests this secret identity even.
I'm just a surge protector doing my job, sir.
@lotherio said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
@icanbeyourmuse said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
A more fighty type? As suggested over hear plans of a mugging or potential murder or whatever and go be heroic and try stopping it with your friends. Train with your buddies, discuss the latest combat techniques. (I don't know much about combat stuff so best I can do)
Not to add more reasons why to go the gala/social event. But this here. Both supers are not familiar though in the comics they end up on the same team. This moment where you're both in your mundane identity and something happens in front of your face - how do you stop it, do you out your secret or do you find another clever way to stop it. Not just the show up later in disguise after overhearing, but literally if you two seem to get along during the social event, move to something happens that tests this secret identity even.
It has been a while since I watched anything super but I recall Bruce/Batman and Clark/Superman have both been pretty clever in explaining their absence at certain times. Got knocked out, was taking notes on the scene in a safe place. Doesn't Bruce/Batman present his Bruce persona as a bit f a coward? Been some time since I watched or read so I could be remembering wrong.
@icanbeyourmuse said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
@lotherio said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
@icanbeyourmuse said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
A more fighty type? As suggested over hear plans of a mugging or potential murder or whatever and go be heroic and try stopping it with your friends. Train with your buddies, discuss the latest combat techniques. (I don't know much about combat stuff so best I can do)
Not to add more reasons why to go the gala/social event. But this here. Both supers are not familiar though in the comics they end up on the same team. This moment where you're both in your mundane identity and something happens in front of your face - how do you stop it, do you out your secret or do you find another clever way to stop it. Not just the show up later in disguise after overhearing, but literally if you two seem to get along during the social event, move to something happens that tests this secret identity even.
It has been a while since I watched anything super but I recall Bruce/Batman and Clark/Superman have both been pretty clever in explaining their absence at certain times. Got knocked out, was taking notes on the scene in a safe place. Doesn't Bruce/Batman present his Bruce persona as a bit f a coward? Been some time since I watched or read so I could be remembering wrong.
Maybe, my last reference is the Snyder Movie and Bruce had pretty much tracked them all down to their alter egos.
But I still think something happening and them reacting while protecting their identity could make for something interesting. Both coward out to be unseen and return as superman batman. Then they can argue, why you got your peanut butter in my chocolate Superman, this is Batman demesne we don't need your Kryptonian do-goodery at Gotham Galas!
My point is more there are tons of reasons to Gala that contributes to story and development that isn't 'Batman enters the Bar RP and sits in he corner giving everyone else no hooks to actually interact with him. All his other poses are dark and brooding and doesn't allow any reason to interact with him'.
http://ifanboy.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Superman-Vol.-1-76-1952.jpg
Apparently getting to know each other's secret identity happens throughout various continuities of the main lines?
@coin said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
lol. Why am I surprised. You have a very, very limited concept of what is worth roleplaying so everything makes sense now.
I don't have the time or energy to waste on a scene that is going to go nowhere an accomplish nothing. I don't understand why you think it's a good use of your time. Sitting around a table talking about how good the donuts are or how spicy the chili fries are at the bowling alley is a waste of everyone's time both IC and OOC.
Think about it, have you ever seen anyone actually have coffee shop chatter in the real world?
Have you ever seen total strangers just sit down at a table and start talking about benign, mundane, stuff for no reason?
Ever see anyone organize a group of strangers for a one-off bowling game then leave without having any other form of contact outside of bowling?
No, you haven't because it's crazy and a massive waste of everyone's time.
Most people don't do it IRL. Some people might do it.
Those people are freaks and weirdos in the eyes of the public because it's abnormal.
So why is it expected in RPGs?
Just eat your donut or drink your beer alone like a normal person who doesn't bother strangers. If you want to bring chatter to the place the invite someone you know and maybe they can invite someone they know and you can all get to know each other but this whole idea that it's cool and expected to just start talking to people you don't know needs to stop.
@de-villefort said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
No, you haven't because it's crazy and a massive waste of everyone's time. Most people don't do it IRL.
Some people might do it. Those people are freaks and weirdos in the eyes of the public because it's abnormal. So why is it expected in RPGs?
Just eat your donut or drink your beer alone like a normal person who doesn't bother strangers.
@de-villefort said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
Think about it, have you ever seen anyone actually have coffee shop chatter in the real world?
Yes. Regularly, over a hot chocolate or a beer or whatever.
Have you ever seen total strangers just sit down at a table and start talking about benign, mundane, stuff for no reason?
Yes. I mean, usually it's someone leaning over from the next table over to interject, but it can turn into all sitting together at the same table.
Ever see anyone organize a group of strangers for a one-off bowling game then leave without having any other form of contact outside of bowling?
Yes. Maybe there's just one lane left, and 2-4 strangers all want to bowl -- why not do it together?
Those people are freaks and weirdos in the eyes of the public because it's abnormal.
Thanks, I like being a freak, a weirdo, and abnormal -- actually I'm an introvert, but I've still been known to do all of these things.
@de-villefort said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
Ever see anyone organize a group of strangers for a one-off bowling game then leave without having any other form of contact outside of bowling?
No, you haven't because it's crazy and a massive waste of everyone's time.
Most people don't do it IRL. Some people might do it.
Those people are freaks and weirdos in the eyes of the public because it's abnormal.
I have no idea what world you live in but literally most bowling allies I go to offer social bowling leagues to meet strangers. Sometimes its one time event sometimes its just open 'league' bowling for whoever randomly shows up.
Here you are again saying most people don't chat with strangers at random 'social' places. Yesterday I was in a conversation with the guy behind me at Home Depot cause the clerk asked what I was buying all the paint for. This weird never happens ever event in your world was 15 minutes of conversation about painting interior vs exterior (cause of the heat), they asking if I was selling, me saying I just want to paint the living room.
A few days earlier I was in a rare doesn't happen in rl social event at the taco bell cause after I ordered on kiosk I started talking with the clerk about kiosks and the next guy game in to get one burrito so I apologized about that, having a big order and him having to wait. We joked a little about me getting the mild sauce for my niece and me calling it baby sauce as I got diablo sauce for me.
Literally yes, random strangers do talk in public at places like coffee houses and bowling alleys. Last bowling alley I went to, I talked at the food area while getting fries and nacho cheese. I took my girls there, I talked with the guy at the counter cause he liked my Ramones shirt.
These situations that people make fun of in coffee/bar rp, how people meet, actually does happen. A lot. How do you think people met each other before like the internet?
@seraphim73 said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
Thanks, I like being a freak, a weirdo, and abnormal -- actually I'm an introvert, but I've still been known to do all of these things.
Heh, true, there are a lot of freaks and weirdos it seems, I lean towards introvert myself but if a stranger (extrovert) talks to me first, I open up a bit.
@de-villefort said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
@coin said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
lol. Why am I surprised. You have a very, very limited concept of what is worth roleplaying so everything makes sense now.
I don't have the time or energy to waste on a scene that is going to go nowhere an accomplish nothing. I don't understand why you think it's a good use of your time. Sitting around a table talking about how good the donuts are or how spicy the chili fries are at the bowling alley is a waste of everyone's time both IC and OOC.
Think about it, have you ever seen anyone actually have coffee shop chatter in the real world?
Have you ever seen total strangers just sit down at a table and start talking about benign, mundane, stuff for no reason?Ever see anyone organize a group of strangers for a one-off bowling game then leave without having any other form of contact outside of bowling?
No, you haven't because it's crazy and a massive waste of everyone's time.
Most people don't do it IRL. Some people might do it.
Those people are freaks and weirdos in the eyes of the public because it's abnormal.
So why is it expected in RPGs?Just eat your donut or drink your beer alone like a normal person who doesn't bother strangers. If you want to bring chatter to the place the invite someone you know and maybe they can invite someone they know and you can all get to know each other but this whole idea that it's cool and expected to just start talking to people you don't know needs to stop.
yikes
"Excuse the hell out of you. He's a bag of dicks. I'm a carefully curated box of cocks." -- to @GirlCalledBlu upon being misrepresented.
Right?
There is so much to unpack here, but the bottom line likely would be that it wouldn't be enjoyable playing with them after one or two scenes. Kudos to those who manage though.
If you go into a 'social' scene with the idea that it's going to be a waste of your time, then you will never be wrong. And yes, RP social scenes often do have a little more 'plot contrivance' than most aspects of RL - and one of the things I like to do is take a look at the other character's wiki or finger to see something I can hang a scene hook off of that makes our conversation a little LESS 'hello random person' - it can be something as simple as 'oh, they have tattoos, so let's make a remark about that' or in a game where the theme and setting have been built with purpose, you can USUALLY find an org or faction hook between two random characters, even if it's only, "Hey, do you work at X? I think I saw you there one time."
There's nothing wrong with wanting a scene that has 'purpose', but that means, you know, put in the effort to build the scene with purpose. Concentrate on the people in the scene with you, figure out why your character might be interested in them, whether it's benevolence, manipulation, or hunger. Don't expect other players to do it - a lot of them just don't. But if YOU do it, then you can often find some satisfaction and way to advance your character's agenda in even the most mundane of social RP.
@pyrephox said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
and one of the things I like to do is take a look at the other character's wiki or finger to see something I can hang a scene hook off of that makes our conversation a little LESS 'hello random person' - ... There's nothing wrong with wanting a scene that has 'purpose', but that means, you know, put in the effort to build the scene with purpose.
Exactly. I'm also not a particular fan of "random people with no reason to interact meet in random public place to talk about the weather." It's awkward. It's boring (for me personally; not judging those who enjoy it).
But it's really not that hard to find a reason for a scene. Even the Superman example given earlier - Clark is a journalist. Journalists are great RP-drivers because they can concoct a meaningful reason to talk to almost anyone. Clark may be his alter-ego but it's still a big part of his life. I wouldn't see those relationships and interactions as meaningless just because he's not wearing his cape at the time.
Jurassic Park (the first one) is another good example. There are a number of scenes that don't move the plot along in a direct way, but are important for building relationships between the characters so that they care about each other (and you, the audience, cares about them) when they finally do get around to being chased by dinosaurs. Those non-action scenes aren't pointless; they're essential.
@icanbeyourmuse said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
Do you walk up to some stranger and go 'I was abused as a child. Has anything like that happened to you?' in RL?
Somewhere, out there, Jill the Guest has heard your siren call and prepares another round of questions about the school nurse...
Racism isn't Tinkerbell. It doesn't need you to believe in it for it to exist.
@derp said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
@icanbeyourmuse said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
Do you walk up to some stranger and go 'I was abused as a child. Has anything like that happened to you?' in RL?
Somewhere, out there, Jill the Guest has heard your siren call and prepares another round of questions about the school nurse...
Jill the Guest is scouring very small places now. We had them or someone like them start in on a player on Jade Crossing, they started asking them weird questions leading to the high school stuff they get into, but the player wasn't biting or feeding them just the right way so they left.
@seraphim73 said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
Thanks, I like being a freak, a weirdo, and abnormal -- actually I'm an introvert, but I've still been known to do all of these things.
@icanbeyourmuse said in MUs That We Would Love To Make (But Won't):
Do you walk up to some stranger and go 'I was abused as a child. Has anything like that happened to you?' in RL?
Somewhere, out there, Jill the Guest has heard your siren call and prepares another round of questions about the school nurse...
