Well, no, not sarcastic. I was just musing, but it was an idea.
People have mentioned removing the ability to stalk, and this would be one way to do it? Clearly (to me), people use Unfindable for various reasons, just as some people clearly use OOC location data to abuse it.
I absolutely agree that people should be resolving their shit, yes. I can't fix that, though. I can offer a way to cut down the problem? Like I said, it was just an offered idea.
I have actually been on a game where a player had so much beef with me that she would literally page half the people who played in rooms alone with my character with 'why are you playing with HER." and other passive aggressive comments that weren't 'quite' harassment and yet made it so people would either always want their unfindable flags on when they were alone with me, or just avoided playing with me because her grief was so intense. That said I am STILL in favor of no unfindable flag in public places. If those players didn't feel like telling her to buzz off but wanted to hide instead, we'd just have to go hide together somewhere alone instead of having a perfectly reasonable sensible conversation in a public place.
And yeah eventually she got booted for harassment. Would have been sooner except I am also staff, and so I felt like I should tolerate more than I would for my players, but eventually enough is enough for anyone. You can write up long, elaborate rules for what 'harassment' is, but ultimately if you systematically are incapable of treating others how you wish to be treated yourself, you need a less social hobby.
@Luna said:
Can't we all be adults who sometimes don't get along? Being cordial and getting along I feel are not really the same. Isn't it ok to not like everyone yet not feel the need to stir up trouble? At what point do you draw the line and say 'ok, you two are not getting along, so person a is allowed to say what they want but you're making them sad and mad, you're not allowed to say shit'.
Getting along doesn't mean liking people, it means maintaining politeness regardless, not being aggressive just because, etc. I don't care if people like one another, that's got nothing to do with the price of tea in China. Getting along means behaving like adults in an adult hobby. It means no slinging insults, and everyone paying attention to what they say. It also means not taking offense at stupid shit, not asking questions you don't want honest answers to, and a whole host of other things as well. The onus isn't on any given person, really, to take the high road. If everyone is getting along, then nobody needs to take the high road.
I have at least a dozen people in my office that I cannot stand. At all. They are, in my opinion, horrible people who should not only be fired, but should probably spend some time in the stocks with their claimants getting baskets of rotten fruit and vegetables. These are people that are genuinely doing awful things that are, unfortunately, just barely within the law. They know they're skirting the line, for the most part. They do it anyway because they're mean.
I still get along with them. I don't have to tell them what I think. I don't have to go have beers with them on a weekend night, either. We're adults in a professional environment. That's what people do. These rules of social conduct can and probably should make the transition to mushing. People are obviously capable of it. Is there drama and BS and problems sometimes? Absolutely. People are people. Usually drama and BS problems like that end up with somebody getting a disciplinary action, a grievance (from the union), or getting fired. Because that shit is not okay.
This is a hobby, not professional, correct. There are a number of reasons my analogy doesn't apply, starting with people having the motivation of money to behave themselves. Our currency is fun, and a lot of people don't need to get along with other people to have fun.
There aren't many of us left that are still in their teens and early twenties. The BS we pulled when we were kids is not okay any more. The hobby really needs to grow the fuck up.
@Rook said:
So, maybe something to think about is removing locations from any OOC commands. +finger, +where, etc. +hangouts and equivalent simply show numbers. Force people to communicate to find or arrange RP. Force people to use the hangouts to wait for happenstance scenes. Force people to be adults.
.
Unless your game is run by assholes, the Unfindable flag is available to anyone who wants it. A lot of people don't use it. So right now we've got a situation where people can remain findable until they decide they have some reason to not be findable.
This doesn't really need to be fixed. All unfindable, all findable, are both opposite extremes and there's no really compelling reason to take either. If +where was adjusted to indicate how many unfindable people were in the room (since +hangouts apparently represents some vastly overcoded weight hanging around the neck of MU*ers everywhere), it'd represent a pretty much perfect solution for everybody not ridiculously invested in either extreme.
@Sunny said:
I have at least a dozen people in my office that I cannot stand. At all. They are, in my opinion, horrible people who should not only be fired, but should probably spend some time in the stocks with their claimants getting baskets of rotten fruit and vegetables. These are people that are genuinely doing awful things that are, unfortunately, just barely within the law. They know they're skirting the line, for the most part. They do it anyway because they're mean.
I hate insurance adjusters too. Luckily, the ones I work with listen to me. I've heard horror stories.
“It is better to live doing the things that you like. It is foolish to live within this dream of a world seeing unpleasantness and doing only things that you do not like.” -- Yamamoto Tsunetomo.
@Ganymede said:
I hate insurance adjusters too. Luckily, the ones I work with listen to me. I've heard horror stories.
Yeah. There are a LOT of Claim Managers that are really really good and wonderful people and in it for the right reasons (helping injured people get back to work), but there are also quite a few that are just....awful. Awful awful awful.
@Gingerlily said:
I have actually been on a game where a player had so much beef with me that she would literally page half the people who played in rooms alone with my character with 'why are you playing with HER." and other passive aggressive comments that weren't 'quite' harassment and yet made it so people would either always want their unfindable flags on when they were alone with me, or just avoided playing with me because her grief was so intense. That said I am STILL in favor of no unfindable flag in public places. If those players didn't feel like telling her to buzz off but wanted to hide instead, we'd just have to go hide together somewhere alone instead of having a perfectly reasonable sensible conversation in a public place.
And yeah eventually she got booted for harassment. Would have been sooner except I am also staff, and so I felt like I should tolerate more than I would for my players, but eventually enough is enough for anyone. You can write up long, elaborate rules for what 'harassment' is, but ultimately if you systematically are incapable of treating others how you wish to be treated yourself, you need a less social hobby.
That person you're talking about sounds like a huge narcissist.
Well, no, not sarcastic. I was just musing, but it was an idea.
People have mentioned removing the ability to stalk, and this would be one way to do it? Clearly (to me), people use Unfindable for various reasons, just as some people clearly use OOC location data to abuse it.
I absolutely agree that people should be resolving their shit, yes. I can't fix that, though. I can offer a way to cut down the problem? Like I said, it was just an offered idea.
