Best posts made by MarsGrad

Early in the eleventh century, Rokugan faced a threat it thought had long since passed. The Lost gaijin Garen Hawthorne had returned at the head of the Shadow Fleet, a massive collection of Rokugani and gaijin ships that had been corrupted by the Shadowland Taint. Determined to conquer Rokugan once and for all, he launched a surprise invasion from the Sea of Shadows that left the Empire reeling. The Great Clans banded together and counterattacked, but after almost two years of fighting, the Shadow Fleet's surprise strike and subsequent naval superiority left them struggling. In a desperate battle that would ultimately determine the fate of the Empire, the Shadow Fleet -- which had already devastated the Great Clan fleets -- was suddenly engaged by the Mantis Clan. Expecting no serious resistance from a minor clan, the Lost were unprepared for the ferocity of the island-bound samurai. The combined might of the Mantis bushi and shugenja crippled the Shadow Fleet and bought the Great Clans enough time to rally and destroy the invading forces. In repayment for the instrumental part they played in ending the threat to the Empire, the Mantis were elevated to Great Clan status.

That was almost one hundred years ago...

Now, Rokugan is in a state of relative peace. The Great Clans have finally managed to recover from the devastation brought on by the Invasion of the Shadow Fleet and returned to their prior strength. The sense of camaraderie borne of war and shared suffering has begun to fade as once again the Clans begin to strive against each other. All the while, another threat builds its strength in the shadows unbeknownst to the Empire, conspiring and plotting to bring down its hated foes...

City of Lies is an upcoming MU* based on the 4th Edition Legends of the Five Rings ruleset. Set in Ryoko Owari, players will have the opportunity to create members of (nearly) every strata of society, from the lowly Bonge, the various peasants and commoners of Rokugan, to the noble Samurai, the lords and warriors of the Empire. In the City of Lies and Stories, honor and dishonor walk hand-in-hand as no clan can afford to ignore the second largest city in the Empire. However, the opium trade stains the reputation of many, and the Lying Darkness is not without its agents. Meanwhile, the vast and mysterious Shinomen Forest lies just west of Ryoko Owari, tempting many to explore its uncharted depths despite the numerous risks.

Staff will regularly offer overarching metaplot, while player plots will not only be supported but encouraged. PCs will lead their clans -- at least locally -- in both political and combat roles as well. NPCs may fill out leadership positions at first, but ultimately we want players to take their spots and help guide the story. City of Lies is set in an alternate timeline, and though it starts at the beginning of the 12th Century, it exists outside of the canon series of events. Players and their characters will by no means be limited to following 'the script' -- many events that happen in the canon timeline likely will never come to pass in ours, and others may occur earlier or later and in drastically altered forms. Even then, the PCs will always have the power to decide how to face any threats that risk the safety and prosperity of Rokugan.

City of Lies uses @Faraday's wonderful Ares code and at the moment CG is about halfway finished with the most complex parts already in place. I plan to open to Alpha shortly after the most vital aspects of the game are finished, with the intention of progressing into a beta and then full open as more features are added. Currently however, we desperately need Staff. We'd like to get a few general Staff to handle jobs, the web portal, and the like, as well as a theme Staffer or two to help manage metaplot stuff. Even if the idea of being a full-time staffer isn't your cup of tea, we would still greatly appreciate anyone willing to donate their time to help get the grid in place or populate theme files before we open.

In the meantime we have an official Discord Server just like all the cool, hip new games here: https://discord.gg/pRe2bVJ

Now that's a name I've not heard in a long time...

@Roz said in Nicholaus @ Arx:

@MarsGrad said in Nicholaus @ Arx:

Now that's a name I've not heard in a long time...

Do you know him?

Well of course I know him. He's me.

Thanks to Ares being so thoroughly idiot-proof, development is going a lot faster and smoother than anticipated. I'll be posting a full ad in a day or two with more concrete info, so stay posted!

From my perspective as a long-time lurker and very occasional poster...

This has all appeared extremely silly, ngl. That might seem dismissive to some of the people who were involved in the very heat of it, but I don't really intend it to be. Overall, the optics from a largely outside observer on all of this haven't really been great, but I feel like that starts to tread into water that's not terribly relevant for the original point of this thread, so I'll attempt to stay on topic.

First off, if you genuinely want to make MSB a positivity-focused environment, you have to understand that you're going to be fighting an uphill battle. The reputation that MSB inherited from WORA and further refined with the Hogpit isn't one that goes hand in hand with 'calm and measured discourse.' You're undoubtedly going to have a lot of people who will try to continue to foster the more hostile environment the place has been known to be for a while. It feels a bit like an Applebee's just bought out a biker bar, so expect the bikers to keep showing up for a while, either in protest or ignorance. Honestly, if I hadn't been watching what's been going on, if someone told me that MSB fractured and a new place opened called Brand MU Day, I definitely wouldn't be putting money on MSB being the one all about positive discourse from here on out.

Anyway, that's just one of the two main hurdles I see going forward. The other is that... like... You're humans, too. You are not immune to tribalism and cliques anymore than the Brand MU Day people are. Be wary of the urge to label any criticism or opinion that you dislike as being hateful or insulting. This is the internet, disagreements are going to happen and they will get heated. Think hard about where you want to draw the line and make sure you make it clear where that line is.

Mind, none of this is to say I've seen evidence of any of this so far. It's just a general warning as someone who has seen and sighed his way through repeated fractures and merges as a comic game fan. Generally speaking, I'm all for a positive environment for discourse. Once upon a time I would have thought it was impossible on the internet, but over the years I've seen a few examples of it (mostly) working so... I'm rooting for you guys, but I wouldn't say I'm totally convinced of the viability of this experiment yet.

Well of course I know him. He's m- Wait, did you ask if I know him?

You're um... You're supposed to ask if I know him.

So I've been considering developing a game set in a Dark or Low-Fantasy world. The focus would be on a smallish city on the edge of civilization with characters being pulled from all walks of (commoner) life, such as artisans, soldiers, guards, bureaucrats, and laborers.

Magic is a thing, and while not wildly common, is also not extremely rare either. Most people probably know two or three people who know a spell or two, but for the most part magic isn't big fireballs and calling lightning storms. It's minor things like alchemy and spirit magic. Only the true masters who live in the heart of the empire and work for Kings and Nobles know proper D&D style magic, and they're incredibly rare. Further, while everyone generally trusts and appreciates their local alchemist or shaman or thaumaturge who work minor wonders like getting rid of pests or brewing curatives or reinforcing your wagon's axle, there are those who go dark side. Witches and Warlocks who dabble in hexes and the Evil Eye and maybe even necromancy if they're nasty.

If only that were the worst of it, for this world is also populated by things that go bump in the night. These would be heavily inspired if not straight stolen from folk tales and legends. Monsters and creatures like the cockatrice, griffins, black dogs, manticores, and yes even vampires and werewolves. They're known threats, though. While your average farmer might not know that salt along the doorway doesn't protect you from a black dog, a professional will, and even better they'll know what CAN stop one.

Which of course means that there will be playable Witch hunters and Monster hunters, specialists trained to find and kill those magic users who have lost their way and the creepy crawlies that go bump in the night.

I'm still debating stuff like blackpowder and its prevelance or introducing minor nobles into the mix.

Influences include, but are not limited to: The Witcher (Obviously), Kingkiller Chronicles, Spook's Apprentice, Folklore, and maybe just a smidge of Arthurian legend.

Setting aside, I'm still shopping around for RPG systems, staff, and feedback so suggestions for any of the three are more than welcome! Thanks!

Edit to clarify: Players would be able to make commoners, but also any of the other more exciting professions. I meant to specify that this isn't a Lords and Ladies game. High nobility and their games and politics wouldn't be the focus. Minor nobility? Maybe. Still unsure. Would have to be pretty limited if so.

Yeah, I mean it's been said in one way or another already, but I don't have an issue with social combat as a theory or a concept. My problem is when it's handled /exactly/ like physical combat, where Johnny B. Goode comes up and poses how he shoots at Space Cowboy and then rolls dice and we get the results. That's fine because the agency is entirely on Johnny in that situation. Whatever Space Cowboy's backstory and personality, a bullet is a bullet. It doesn't override Space Cowboy's character or development to be shot.

The problem comes when Johnny walks up to Space Cowboy and poses a big threatening speech trying to intimidate Space Cowboy into backing down by implying he's going to harm and kill Space Cowboy. Then he rolls dice, gets an awesome result and Space Cowboy is expected to be cowed by this, even though it's been established that Space Cowboy is a masochist and doesn't fear death. It overrides his admittedly cliche character and ignores his personality.

I'd love it if Johnny came up to Space Cowboy and said, 'Okay Space Cowboy, I'm going to try and intimidate you into backing down.' Then he rolls his dice, gets his awesome result, and then works with him to decide how he might do that, ie. Space Cowboy maybe worries about his friends and Johnny managed to convince him that 'Oh, you might be able to stop me, but not before I kill your whole crew' or something.

Very rarely is this done. Most people just want to play out social combat like physical combat and ignore the differences because they both involve dice, but there's an entirely different rhythm and approach to it.

I want to do one of these things, and TECHNICALLY I've played enough chars in enough places to make it worthwhile, but hell if I remember much of any of their names. I suck at the names. Just the stories. That said, I do remember some of their names. Like:

Game of Bones
-Vidomir Bolton
-Donovar Bolton
-Dalton Greyjoy
-Vhaegor Targaryen
-Eoric Dayne

AtonementRPI
-Skinner (Some metal armed Vulture dude.)
-Heinrich (A German guy from near the end. I don't remember the sdesc at all)

SoI
-Locke

Masq
-Prosper Felix
-Skinner Lee

HeroMux
-Dr. Doom
-Mr. Sinister

Staffed:

HeroMux
-Oz

CoMux
-Mobius

Currently:

Dystopia
-Chase

MotM
-Grant
-Iori

Those are the ones I remember specifically, though I will say I used the name Skinner on a lot of games, particularly WoD games. Also I think Burning Post II once. No doubt a few others, as well.

(Work in progress as I remember more)

Yeah, I mean... I understand the initial outcry of 'this is clearly discrimination and thus not okay,' but I think I have to agree with surreality on this. It's not like you have to submit a birth certificate to be allowed in. You yourself don't have to be male or gay/bi to play. It just supports a specific kind of character to the exclusion of all others. Is it going to be everyone's cup of tea? No. Do I think it's intended to be or is hostile or a Bad Thing(tm)? No.

Of course, then the question arises: If the specific kind of character was only white, straight males, would it still be okay? But I'm not going to touch that. Just bring it up and leave it here. Because.

@derp Fair enough, but the other other side of that is that someone with those resistances is now immune to literally every angle of attack on their character. They no long fear death or the death of loved ones. They're immune to the charms of the most seductive wo/man. They're completely indomitable, incorruptible, and also they're really self-righteous. They have no weak spots because we've taken backstory and personality out of the equation. A dude with a ton of armor and the best physical resistances on the game will still get steamrolled by enough firepower, but this guy can't ever be convinced of anything.

Social stats are far too vague to work effectively on their own.

I'm loving Beip, but I still miss Potato's built-in notepad that let you format linebreaks and tabs with a keyboard shortcut and then either paste the whole thing into the input window or just send it to the game. Don't suppose I'm just dumb and that already exists in some form or another?

@Kanye-Qwest

@pyrephox That is a sound argument for any game that focuses more on the game than the RP.

Unfortunately most MUs do not. If the bulk of the game is in the characterization of the PCs, not the dice rolls, than it's actually more obtuse to expect the personalities of the PCs to be completely irrelevant to rolls specifically targeting said personality.

Also, I don't think anyone is suggesting 'my character has goals and personality quirks' should act like ironclad armor. They're detriments to certain approaches. They're the cover you take in a gunfight. The smoke screen laid down by your allies. They should be treated as penalties (and bonuses) to an opposing character's roll based on how they go about convincing Space Cowboy to do the thing they want him to do. Or at the very least you should work with Space Cowboy to make your awesome intimidation/persuasion/seduction check believable.

@faraday said in Social 'Combat': the hill I will die on (because I took 0 things for physical combat):

@marsgrad said in Social 'Combat': the hill I will die on (because I took 0 things for physical combat):

Also, I don't think anyone is suggesting 'my characters has goals and personality quirks' should act like ironclad armor.

Just to be clear: Yes, I am suggesting exactly that. Some things just won't work on some people, just like you can't take out a tank with a pocketknife. Just like no matter how many points I make or how well I make them, I won't sway some people here to change their views on social combat.

I stand somewhat corrected.

Let me rephrase: "I don't think anyone is suggesting a character's goals and personality quirks should act as fully encasing, 360 degree, impenetrable platemail that renders them immune to all forms of persuasion, etc. It just makes certain approaches non-viable just like, say, attacking a tank with a pocketknife.

This whole thread has been immensely entertaining at times and terribly hard to watch at others.

It's been a real roller-coaster ride.

So, I'm in the very early stages of development here (literally still working out all the setting information and everything), but I was thinking about opening an L5R 4e game set in Ryoko Owari AKA the City of Lies sometime in the 12th century after the Second Day of Thunder. Potentially The Four Winds Era but also potentially not. Nothing is necessarily set in stone yet.

I'm thinking Ryoko Owari should offer a good mix of political shenanigans for high and low honor characters alike, an outlet for all those dishonorable criminals looking to get into the opium trade, and relative proximity to The Shinomen Forest for the adventurous types. I'm going to be honest here, I'm probably going to be looking at Arx as a very loose inspiration. I think the various systems are a little bit too complex for me personally, but I think they've done an excellent job in general at making a game that feels responsive to player actions.

Primarily, I just want to get some feedback for interest in the setting and system -- I welcome suggestions and critiques! I also want to potentially put out some feelers for people who might want to get in on development. This is kind of a pet project of mine, so I'm going to chug along with it anyway even if I have to learn Ruby or Python myself and do horrible, terrible things to Ares or Evennia, but having help would definitely speed things along and make it less likely to implode in a stiff breeze.

@skew As far as I'm aware, the wiki is still under construction so there's nothing to link yet.

@SunnyJ Plotting and scheming are two of my favorite things!

Yeah, I'm not so sure about setting it during the new movies either. One, AoA's already on that. Two, everyone and their grandmother does either Pre-Empire, or Post-New Hope. Or occasionally Old Republic. A shake-up would be nice. Three, that's going to get messy with nine not even released yet, and honestly, while I like the movies, FO vs Resistance is Empire vs Rebels but less interesting, so short of allowing people to play FCs and reenact their favorite scenes (which would get old fast and also goes against your no FC policy which I am totally in favor of), it seems like there's more potential elsewhere. Set it during the New Sith Wars. Haven't seen that one yet. Mandos while they were still riding basilisk war droids down from atmo allied with a struggling Republic against a resurgent and fractured Sith Empire? Sounds crazy. Maybe crazy enough to work.

Maybe too crazy, who knows.

Either way, I'm going to be playing a Hutt and running all the crime ever, so it's not like my opinion counts for a whole lot.

As for the broad range vs narrow focus? Eh. I dunno'. Star Wars kind of thrives on the many diverse factions and people/creatures. I can see the point of trying to herd people together to facilitate RP, but I can also see how that could spoil the fun. I play Indies primarily. Being forced to go Rebellion/Resistance or Empire/FO because that's what the whole game is, would be an instant deal breaker for me. I'm sure there's others with a similar opinion if the game was fully indy and they really like playing a Stormtrooper. I'd suggest looking for a different solution, ultimately.