What do player-STs need?
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I know there are obvious answers, like players, sign up sheets for public events etc. Coded things like temp rooms, and ooc-channel chat for a given story group are nice, but less what I am looking for. Though if something like that is critical, please share.
I am more focussed on what player-STs need from staff, that they feel only staff can give them.
This is for open event STs, specific group STs, player-STs that have been staff in other places. Anyone STing for other players, who does not have access to staff decision making, any staff only information sources, etc.
This would also apply to situations where two or a few players are expected to do their own thing, but might not think of it as STing for others, as i imagine scenes in super hero games might be.
I have a waggish sense of humor.
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Speaking only for myself, encouragement and interest.
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Very clear rules for both runners and those participating is my top need.
What is or is not PRP-acceptable?
What are my limits?
What power level am I allowed to use for NPCs?
What do I have to submit for approval?
Do I even NEED approval, or can I grab four buddies and hit a PRP room?
What do I do if somebody is disruptive?
What do I do if someone is mean?
When can I kick somebody out of my prp, and what do I have to do OOCly if I do that?Not all encompassing, but having these SORTS of things defined -- having a framework and clear expectations -- makes it FAR easier to run plots. There is nothing better you can do than providing clarity. Other things are also useful, but this makes the largest impact.
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@Sunny could you expand on the topic "what are my limits?"
Any examples, which you can anonymize as desired, would be great.
Is there something that often stops the action until you cab get a staff answer?
Is there something that make you (and thus your players) feel like this story could matter over all? Or does that not typically matter?
I have a waggish sense of humor.
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There are a lot of other things involved that are useful and helpful, and I'm absolutely not speaking to all of them. This isn't an all-encompassing list, but these were examples themselves, to illustrate the "you need clearly defined policies surrounding PRPs" as the #1 most important thing to have. It literally does not matter WHAT the policies themselves are, they just need to support your game and be clear.
As far as "what are my limits", I am speaking to policy limits. Is there a power level cap for antagonists? Are there theme issues that I am not allowed to use? Can I kill PCs? If there's limits or rules around what a PRP runner can or can't do, they need to be clear. If there AREN'T limits, that also needs to be clear.
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@reversed do you mean encouragement and interest in staff, or players? How would that be shown?
I have a waggish sense of humor.
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@Misadventure said in What do player-STs need?:
@reversed do you mean encouragement and interest in staff, or players? How would that be shown?
I mean from staff, toward players running plots.
It's fun to run plots for other players, and on some games it's actually a virtue to hermetically seal your PRPs off from staff's view (this is usually a sign of a game having bad staff, if you specifically don't want them noticing your player group). But most of the time, staff taking an interest in what players are adding to the world of their game and encouraging the players to continue doing so is... I mean, it's encouraging.
I would not be half as ready to run various and sundry PRPs on Arx if it wasn't for people like @Apos and @Herja being willing to listen to me natter on about my ideas and giving me feedback on how to make them better, or how to incorporate them within the greater mesh of the game's story.
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For me, it's always deeply encouraging when staff using PrPs to change the world in some way. Not huge ways! But I remember on Darkwater, something a few of us in the Autumn Court did unexpectedly gave a bonus to Harvesting fear in part of a grid for a while. That was /cool/. It made me want to run more things.
Anything that helps me, as a GM, feel that I'm running something that matters in the over all story of the game.
From players, what really helps inspire me to reach out to people and run things for them are good RP hooks. Meaty ones that aren't just a list of hobbies. 'Once ran with the South Side Manglers, was jumped out after being accepted to college' is something that would inspire me to go 'what if a Mangler showed up needing help? What would this character do?' and then I want to find out.
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@Pyrephox I think "changing the world" is something I really get stuck on. Like what could I do as a game admin to make you feel like you are changing the world?
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Collaboration, mainly.
Sometimes staff get... defensive. Almost competitive - they try to put too many regulations, too many checks and balances, too many rules.
It all works out so much better if a ST feels they are wanted and prized on the game, and that the plots they throw can be picked up and enriched by the 'official' metaplot rather than merely tolerated.
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@bear_necessities said in What do player-STs need?:
@Pyrephox I think "changing the world" is something I really get stuck on. Like what could I do as a game admin to make you feel like you are changing the world?
I'll give an example from my recent talks with Apos and Herja re: Arx stuff.
I worked with them to come up for ideas for a family of roster characters I plan to submit for the org one of my characters runs (Redreef). In looking at the scattered little pieces that had already been established in the area that we were working from, I hit upon the idea that maybe the family's secret history is this. And Apostate said "oh, that would actually tie very nicely in to that, and maybe that's one of the reasons why some historical figure did some event in lore."
Obviously the above is all terribly vague for a reason, but that kind of "Oh, wow, that would flesh out this existing piece of lore and add a deep connection to an existing thing" made me feel good, because whoever picks up these characters will now have a deep connection to an existing thing (but they'll have to work to find out what it is lol).
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@bear_necessities said in What do player-STs need?:
@Pyrephox I think "changing the world" is something I really get stuck on. Like what could I do as a game admin to make you feel like you are changing the world?
It doesn't have to be a huge thing. Like, I get thrilled when a PrP in a modern setting makes the IC news and I didn't have to write it, or if something that happened in the plot gets mentioned as a aggravator/mediator for something else in other plots: A challenger runs for mayor because just LOOK at the robbery on Main Street last month - clearly Mayor Big is not doing his job, and we need Change!
For me, and this is just speaking as a player and should not be taken as universal experience, the thing I want most from a persistent setting is for it to reflect the things I do. Not in the sense of 'and now I'm going to completely change this world' but when I poke at the setting, I want it to poke back in SOME way. As a player, that means I want consequences (good or bad) for what I do, in a way that makes sense for the setting and reflects my character's rolls/skills/abilities. As a GM, it means that I want my plots to take place in an integrated setting, and have meaning beyond the moment that they're run.
That doesn't mean I want them to run forever, or that I want to be able to burn down City Hall or kill off the King in a PrP. But the one thing that is guaranteed to keep me /engaged/ as a GM is when someone takes something from a plot I ran and ties it into the world.
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I think the most important thing is to know exactly what is NOT allowed. Have a clear line of demarcation where anything past X is forbidden. I think you would have to draw several lines too, depending on the context. Magic? Combat? Beasties? Npcs? World Impact?
Whatever isn't allowed, let me know.
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What I need is players who want to be there. Anything else I can fake, work around, make shit up about, and sort out.
The other thing I need is, as Silverfox also points out, is to know what I'm not allowed to do. What kind of ideas am I allowed to seed? What kind of impact can I have? What kind of thinking am I allowed to inspire in characters?
http://keys.aresmush.com -- Come to Chincoteague, we have ponies.
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@L-B-Heuschkel A classic issue (and in some cases, 'issue') is what players can 'get' from a player-ran PrP.
For example your group infiltrates the vampire terrorist group and slays them! Yay! But their semi-automatic weapons are now among their ashes. Can the PCs claim them?
Many staff teams try to regulate this very clearly, and even with the best intentions, yet it often results in creating wiki pages with a zillion rules trying to predict every possible scenario ahead of time. That often makes it... challenging (and hostile looking) to use.
It can end up looking very much like staff does not want you to run a plot that has any impact at all, rather than just trying to make it fair and clear for everyone.
- He who takes offense when not intended is a fool. He who takes offense when intended is a greater fool.
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Yeah, I think it's very important to frame this sort of policy as what's possible, rather than what's not allowed.
"You MAY use up to X or Y" rather than "You MAY NOT use over X or Y" provides the framework people need without being discouraging.
eta: (NO guidance is far worse than BAD guidance; choice paralysis and having absolutely no idea if staff is going to come down on you for something because you're guessing -- oh boy)
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I should also say that this question was "from staff", so that's where my answers are coming from. I agree entirely with those commenting that the most important thing is having other players engaged and interested in what you're running.
Staff doesn't really provide/engage with that beyond the policy level, but they DO engage with it: by clearly demonstrating that staff encourages PRPs and considers them to be a valid way to interact with the world. If staff make it clear by providing a solid framework for people to run plots, creates tools for people to do so, and incorporates information from those plots into their game resolution/IC communication methods, it makes it clear to the other players that PRPs are valid. If prps are valid, PRP runners will be engaged with by interested people. If you build it, they WILL come.
eta: emphasis on the fact that I did not name specific tools. it doesn't matter what the tools are. you just have to have clearly made tools for people to use. the effort here is literally what matters.
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@Arkandel Yes. This is why you need to know, from staff, where the edges of the sandbox are. What sort of loot can I let players take off with? What kind of change can I make?
And if the answer to either is 'none', I'm still good. I am very much the kind of story teller who values character development and moral quandaries over loot and boss kills; and of course this is also reflected in who decides to join my stuff. Not every event is for every audience, after all.
So for me, personally, the answer is still -- warm bodies, and clear instructions on what I can and cannot let my players do.
@Arkandel said in What do player-STs need?:
It can end up looking very much like staff does not want you to run a plot that has any impact at all, rather than just trying to make it fair and clear for everyone.
Yes. I have been places that fell into this pitfall. The rules need to be a hell of a lot simpler. Give me, "Nope, you can't make any long term change but feel free to give them some baubles and personal development" and I can work with that. Anything more complex, I'm happy to toss in a request first and get staff approval (or disapproval).
Just, please, don't make me read 500 pages to see if I can rules lawyer my way into possibly running something without ending up with a reprimand.
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@L-B-Heuschkel could you expand on the ability to seed ideas?
I'd like to ask what peoples experience or expectations are around "loot". I typically play games where there are purchased traits that govern what you routinely have access to, so if you don't buy up a trait, you don't expand your access/resources/whatever.
How important or successful are pieces of staff run stories for player-STs? Like if something BIG and staff run is going to happen, giving cues and ideas for smaller pieces to hepl build up to the big story?
In a similar vein, what about background type cues to incorporate but not be the focus, eg your neighborhood has surging community spirit, or the market for something has gone up or down, or the war between two distant forces has had events?
I have a waggish sense of humor.
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@Misadventure To me, seeding ideas is a combination of dropping hints and suggestions of things that may happen down the line; introducing an NPC who will be a big deal later, or dropping information that seems not so relevant now, until suddenly next week, someone goes OH WAIT.
It can also be bringing up new angles or different points of view to the existing -- inspiring players to grab a ball and run with it. I think the best example I've seen was a closing scene in a storyline I did in which the villain NPC was defeated. A supernatural creature, it was then brought back by another player and adopted as a guardian spirit by them -- which leads to all kinds of new shenanigans.
To me, a lot of this has to do with letting go of the reins. You throw balls up in the air; some of them get caught. Players think outside of the box, do things you had not expected -- you grab those balls and run with them. Stories never turn out the way I expect and that is part of what keeps me entertained. Nothing like planning a big epic fight, only to have the gang shame a sixteen tons dragon into slinking off like an embarrassed puppy.
On the official metaplot/staff-run things: I tend to run pretty parallel because that way, I can do what I want to do without needing to coordinate closely (this is a big deal for me since I'm in European time and having to wait to talk to someone in PST will literally slow everything to a halt for 24 hours or more).
I also enjoy doing what I call ambience events -- we had a major storm of the century plot on Gray Harbor recently, and during that, I ran stuff in a hurricane shelter. So, related to the official story, but not so closely tied in that I lock anyone in anything.
