Comics Stuff
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I actually don't mind. One of the things I dislike about comics is the status quo that long-running characters seem to have. I like new stories, changes, etc.
That said, the continuity reboots are happening too often, which is the real issue. It's too often.
This, however, is the first time that Marvel has done something like this. DC has done it tons of times; but it's a first for Marvel.
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Secret Wars has been fairly glorious all told. Probably the best event I have ever read.
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I want to read it, but I am going to wait until someone has compiled the entire thing in a single torrent or something, and organized it in order. Because otherwise I'm going to lose my mind trying to follow it all.
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I feel that. There are still tie-Ins that haven't even started yet. But Thors is the book if the year.
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@tragedyjones
I hate you so much.I read like two pages into the CSI style scene in the first Thors and would have burned it if it were a physical object instead of a file. I settled for running it through a file shredder just to make sure it was gone forever. So terrible.
@Arkandel
A-Force....what? Hadn't heard of this, so wikipedia'd it.The series takes place following Marvel's 2015 "Secret Wars" crossover event, which finds the entire Marvel Universe, including the Avengers, disbanded. What is left is a patchwork of different environments and on one such environment called Arcadia, which Wilson describes as a "feminist paradise", a familiar threat arises that forces A-Force to come together.
Any time a guy says he's going to describe a "feminist paradise", I foresee incoming lulz.
It's this world where the Marvel heroines are leaders in their own civilization. I really didn't want to have some kind of validating reason... So I didn't want to do anything like, "all the men disappeared years ago" or "ever since all the menfolk were killed in that war" or something like that. There are men—there are heroes there. You'll see familiar faces and favorites, but the heroines are in charge, by majority. It's just this is how their world evolved. They were competent. They were clever and they were the ones in charge because of their skills and they were the best fit for these roles and demands of their world.
Sure, sure. I mean, isn't that always why one gender is predominantly in charge of a world? Because they're clever, skilled, and were the best fit for those roles and demands?
Protip: If you really didn't want to have a validating reason, don't give a reason. It's big multiverse. 'Just because' would have been fine. Nobody would have asked.
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"Excuse the hell out of you. He's a bag of dicks. I'm a carefully curated box of cocks." -- to @GirlCalledBlu upon being misrepresented.
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@Coin said:
@HelloRaptor said:
Nobody would have asked.
Bullshit.
Nobody who matters would have asked? I can't account for all the random crazies in the world.
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@HelloRaptor said:
@Coin said:
@HelloRaptor said:
Nobody would have asked.
Bullshit.
Nobody who matters would have asked? I can't account for all the random crazies in the world.
That's different, but still doesn't account for the amount of idiots who not only would have asked, but would have also raised a stink over it. Because it's about ethics in comic book journalism.
"Excuse the hell out of you. He's a bag of dicks. I'm a carefully curated box of cocks." -- to @GirlCalledBlu upon being misrepresented.
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@Coin said:
@HelloRaptor said:
@Coin said:
@HelloRaptor said:
Nobody would have asked.
Bullshit.
Nobody who matters would have asked? I can't account for all the random crazies in the world.
That's different, but still doesn't account for the amount of idiots who not only would have asked, but would have also raised a stink over it. Because it's about ethics in comic book journalism.
Why account for those idiots? Honestly, has anything ever been done in comics that draws outside the lines that hasn't raised a stink? i mean, I just assume that basically anything a comic ever does is going to raise internet outrage.
I suppose I could have clarified that in the context of the sort of people being addressed in the quote, none of them would have asked, but I figured that was kind of obvious.
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@HelloRaptor said:
@Coin said:
@HelloRaptor said:
@Coin said:
@HelloRaptor said:
Nobody would have asked.
Bullshit.
Nobody who matters would have asked? I can't account for all the random crazies in the world.
That's different, but still doesn't account for the amount of idiots who not only would have asked, but would have also raised a stink over it. Because it's about ethics in comic book journalism.
Why account for those idiots? Honestly, has anything ever been done in comics that draws outside the lines that hasn't raised a stink? i mean, I just assume that basically anything a comic ever does is going to raise internet outrage.
I suppose I could have clarified that in the context of the sort of people being addressed in the quote, none of them would have asked, but I figured that was kind of obvious.
Since when do I need a reason to nitpick at you as a matter of course?
And while we're on that, since when do idiotsneed to be addressed to have any desire to stick their shit where it ain't wanted?
So there.
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@HelloRaptor if you didn't like Thors then you are scientifically the worst.
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@tragedyjones
That first comic was like CSI except with a bunch of marvel characters who are also Thor now. That's just slop. I mean, I like CSI, and I like Thor, but what the fuck? I like chocolate and computers but I'd rather not have my motherboard made out of chocolate, that's just going to be a nonfunctional mess.
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@Arkandel
A-Force....what? Hadn't heard of this, so wikipedia'd it.The series takes place following Marvel's 2015 "Secret Wars" crossover event, which finds the entire Marvel Universe, including the Avengers, disbanded. What is left is a patchwork of different environments and on one such environment called Arcadia, which Wilson describes as a "feminist paradise", a familiar threat arises that forces A-Force to come together.
Any time a guy says he's going to describe a "feminist paradise", I foresee incoming lulz.
Or, you know, it's J. Willow Wilson, writer of the new (and acclaimed) Ms. Marvel and -- a woman.
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Also @HelloRaptor quoted me as posting that, which I didn't, but we're used to him doing that by now.
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Apologies on the misattribution, and thank you for pointing that out to me. I'm not familiar with most writers/artists, and there's no gender pronouns in the topmost part of the article where she's noted.
I was skimming the prior paragraph leading up to the larger quote and juxtaposed G. Willow Wilson and Daniel Ketchum where it's talking about bringing Bennet on board, and uses the gender pronoun 'he'. The larger quote I used is also from Bennet (also a woman), not Wilson either, so apparently Soapbox isn't the only community whose names I keep swapping around.
That said, I stand by my sarcasm. If anything, that makes it worse. A world where the women hold the same disproportionate degree of authority in their society as men do in ours, but totally not for the same reasons, because god forbid.
My housemate said, when I showed her the quote, "A 'feminist utopia' would be one where everyone was equal, not one where 'women are in charge instead of men'."
That said, having had a while to think about it, it's possible it's just a really shitty description. A lot of leadership and authority, especially in fiction, tends to involve coincidence and opportunity as much as anything else. If it's a world where everyone is treated equally and not held back or pushed forward by their gender, then there's a certain probability that in a society that's split 50/50 by gender (please no spiral into gender fluidity/spectrum here) women would have been at the right place and the right time to take advantage of those opportunities. Like flipping heads a bunch of times instead of tails.
Blah blah blah, overthinking it. Which I wouldn't be doing if there hadn't been the prefacing line of "I really didn't want to have some kind of validating reason.", and she just hadn't come up with a poorly stated validating reason immediately afterwards.
Before anybody gets all their feathers ruffled, I've got zero problem with a world (comics or otherwise) where women are predominantly in charge. If that entire quote had just said "We didn't really want to have some kind of validating reason, so that's just the way it is. In our world, the people in charge just happen to be mostly women." I wouldn't have batted an eyelash. It's certainly a far more plausible idea for a world than a lot of the other patchwork stuff.
tl;dr As usual I'm just irritated by what are probably largely meaningless semantics in a throwaway comment. Also apparently terrible at putting the right name to the right post. I almost directed this one at @Arkandel instead of @Roz again.
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I believe in a meritocracy, where you get where you belong because of your skills and behavior. No more "<X> is better than <Y>" when talking about sexes, races, credos or orientations.
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@Roz said:
Or, you know, it's J. Willow Wilson, writer of the new (and acclaimed) Ms. Marvel and -- a woman.
People considered Dan Brown an "acclaimed" writer too.
I don't have much to add to that, but I think the explanation sounds trite and unnecessary.
“It is better to live doing the things that you like. It is foolish to live within this dream of a world seeing unpleasantness and doing only things that you do not like.” -- Yamamoto Tsunetomo.
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@Ganymede said:
@Roz said:
Or, you know, it's J. Willow Wilson, writer of the new (and acclaimed) Ms. Marvel and -- a woman.
People considered Dan Brown an "acclaimed" writer too.
I don't have much to add to that, but I think the explanation sounds trite and unnecessary.
Well, I consider Brown to be a popular writer more than anything else. I don't really know how he does with critics.
I guess it could sound trite and unnecessary, I was moreso trying to point out that Wilson has a pretty high amount of cred going into this, both in comics and journalism and other non-fiction writing. Her background is more academic than your average comic writer. However, a way easier way to rankle me would be remembering that writers like Bendis and Remender have a bunch of cred that drives me absolutely crazy, so there's that.
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@Roz said:
@Ganymede said:
@Roz said:
Or, you know, it's J. Willow Wilson, writer of the new (and acclaimed) Ms. Marvel and -- a woman.
People considered Dan Brown an "acclaimed" writer too.
I don't have much to add to that, but I think the explanation sounds trite and unnecessary.
Well, I consider Brown to be a popular writer more than anything else. I don't really know how he does with critics.
I guess it could sound trite and unnecessary, I was moreso trying to point out that Wilson has a pretty high amount of cred going into this, both in comics and journalism and other non-fiction writing. Her background is more academic than your average comic writer. However, a way easier way to rankle me would be remembering that writers like Bendis and Remender have a bunch of cred that drives me absolutely crazy, so there's that.
Cred or not, I still find her 'Feminist Paradise = Women Are In Charge' to be kind of weak, but the larger quote that I was picking at more turned out to not even be her.
I do like the new Ms. Marvel, sort of. I like the writing and the story, but a lot of the art style and perspective choices kind of grate on me. Camera perspective, not character perspective.
Also, for all of her acclaim, it's G. Willow Wilson, not J.
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Meritocracy can include arranging unethical or not in the correct spirit end runs around evaluation and enforcement systems.
Gaming the system is a success skill.
Just look at the Hugos.
