Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.

Sunny · Dec 14, 2017, 6:59 PM

I am not sure why it makes me so happy to see lawyers talking lawyer things and helping each other like this, but it does. Warm fuzzies and everything.

Aria · Dec 14, 2017, 7:04 PM

@sunny said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

I am not sure why it makes me so happy to see lawyers talking lawyer things and helping each other like this, but it does. Warm fuzzies and everything.

Maybe the same reason I enjoy it?

It's an excellent reminder that not everyone on the internet is a mouthbreather from the YouTube comments section.

Ganymede · Dec 14, 2017, 7:14 PM

@sunny said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

I am not sure why it makes me so happy to see lawyers talking lawyer things and helping each other like this, but it does. Warm fuzzies and everything.

Hell, I'll help opposing counsel when it comes to figuring out how to get around procedural problems that affect us both.

One thing you learn in the law fast, if you're good at it: you can't know everything. Be humble, be nice, play well with others, and you'll get a good, steady reputation as being trustworthy and dependable. That will take you much farther than being a dickbag.

saosmash · Dec 14, 2017, 7:23 PM

@ganymede said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

@saosmash said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

It's a little hazier when we're in dependency law. It's a civil case that they are appointed counsel to protect their constitutional rights to parent. I think TECHNICALLY I can override him re telephonic testimony but it's a little hard to manage a case for a client who won't stop screaming about his confrontation rights and how everything is illegal and unjustified literally every time you call him.

Peeve: People who think the Confrontation Clause applies to non-criminal adjudications.

Bless you for handling this shit, though. I'd be bad at it.

Yeah, there's a reason turnover on the contract is high even though it's a fair amount of money. You lose a lot because the facts are always awful and there's a lot of playing social worker / unqualified therapist. On the other hand, somebody's gotta do it and they pay me.

LoaKey · Dec 14, 2017, 7:46 PM

Ringback tones. I fucking HATE ringback tones. As someone who has to listen to your shitty ass song, then your recorded voicemail message, then the automated generic one, to leave you a reminder to come to your damn appointment, I ask you - Please, just stop.

Derp · Dec 14, 2017, 7:57 PM

Other law-related peeves, just to get them off my chest before we return you to your regularly scheduled kvetching:

@ Local Prosecutor: When someone kills someone else as part of the commission of a crime, it is absolutely not self defense, pretty much ever. The statutes say so. The courts have said so. What are you, new here?

@ Indiana Supreme Court : We know you get all defensive about your dominion over the practice of law (see: IOLTA fucking debacle), but can you asshats please stop messing with things you aren't really authorized to mess with? Like, the Indiana Constitution, maybe? We put those words in it for a reason. You don't get to craft an opinion that serves as a repeal. Kthxbai.

Faceless · Dec 14, 2017, 7:59 PM

@derp said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

@ Local Prosecutor: When someone kills someone else as part of the commission of a crime, it is absolutely not self defense, pretty much ever. The statutes say so. The courts have said so. What are you, new here?

begins taking notes

saosmash · Dec 14, 2017, 8:04 PM

@derp Isn't that the felony murder rule that we learned about 1L year?

Derp · Dec 14, 2017, 8:17 PM

@saosmash said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

@derp Isn't that the felony murder rule that we learned about 1L year?

Yeah, but in Indiana it can qualify you for sudden heat, so voluntary manslaughter is possible.

Still not self-defense, even given the unbelievably broad scope we gave to self defense doctrine.

Auspice · Dec 14, 2017, 8:59 PM

@loakey said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

Ringback tones. I fucking HATE ringback tones. As someone who has to listen to your shitty ass song, then your recorded voicemail message, then the automated generic one, to leave you a reminder to come to your damn appointment, I ask you - Please, just stop.

Those still exist? I didn't even realize they were still a thing. I remember when Verizon introduced them. Jesus.

Thenomain · Dec 14, 2017, 8:59 PM

Things I'm glad for:

Programming is easier than law.

Ganymede · Dec 14, 2017, 9:13 PM

@derp said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

Yeah, but in Indiana it can qualify you for sudden heat, so voluntary manslaughter is possible.

Still not self-defense, even given the unbelievably broad scope we gave to self defense doctrine.

Over where I'm at, felony murder disqualifies you from a voluntary manslaughter charge unless the prosecutor is unable to get you for the felony during which you are accused of killing another. The reason for this rule is that it eliminates the "impassioned killing" argument, which undercuts the purpose of felony murder's harsh consequences.

Derp · Dec 14, 2017, 9:27 PM

@Ganymede

Have I mentioned that both our Legislature and Supreme Court are insane? Because they are.

They are also frequently at loggerheads. (Example: We were 50 out of 50 in implementing IOLTA because the SC thought it went against the takings clause. Legislature finally passed it. SC got all up in arms because the Constitution gives exclusive control over the practice of law to the SC, so the SC invalidates the law, and then trumpets that they have made a rule implementing IOLTA with the exact. Same. Provisions.)

So weird shit goes down here.

Packrat · Dec 14, 2017, 9:43 PM

Legal stuff is complicated. Personally I am not a lawyer but I am an 'expert' (apparently?) in legislation concerning export control. ITAR, EAR, Wassenaar compliance, etc.

I just had a meeting with one of the vice presidents in my company of employment where he expressed the belief that 'Ohh, we do not need that kind of support, we know all of that, it is built into our thought process and we all understand it'.

What the shit. I have been doing this for a decade and I do not know everything. I briefed a room full of his first line reports on the subject for four hours then they followed up by between them booking over twenty hours of my time for follow up consultation, questions and advise in the light of the apparently startling revelations I had given them about how their business areas were impacted in ways they had not foreseen.

Added: Also the gutting of the State Department in the US makes my life a nightmare, because apparently the US government has decided that their laws apply to everyone, everywhere in the world but the current administration has crippled the people who actually enforce this, grant licences or answer questions. It has reached the point where the place I work is quite literally willing to spend tens of millions of dollars to avoid employing engineers in the United States and instead replicate their work elsewhere.

Auspice · Dec 15, 2017, 5:55 PM

"We're running late."
"Well, that's fine, so long as you can still give me a ride to work."
"We can't, we have to meet people in Plano."

OH I DON'T KNOW MAYBE TELL THEM YOU'LL BE LATE TO SEE THEM BECAUSE YOU'RE SEEING YOUR DAUGHTER FOR THE LAST TIME FOR FUCK KNOWS HOW LONG? Yeah. This cements it. I'm only allowing this because I want the last of their shit out of my apartment, but I am fucking done. They're prioritizing my father's fucking coworkers over me.

(And same as last week, waited until the last minute to tell me so I couldn't find a better workaround.)

Derp · Dec 15, 2017, 7:16 PM

@auspice said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

"We're running late."
"Well, that's fine, so long as you can still give me a ride to work."
"We can't, we have to meet people in Plano."

OH I DON'T KNOW MAYBE TELL THEM YOU'LL BE LATE TO SEE THEM BECAUSE YOU'RE SEEING YOUR DAUGHTER FOR THE LAST TIME FOR FUCK KNOWS HOW LONG? Yeah. This cements it. I'm only allowing this because I want the last of their shit out of my apartment, but I am fucking done. They're prioritizing my father's fucking coworkers over me.

(And same as last week, waited until the last minute to tell me so I couldn't find a better workaround.)

Just make sure you get their signature on the wills that leave everything to you before you cut the brake lines. Be practical.

Lisse24 · Dec 15, 2017, 7:18 PM

@auspice said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

"We're running late."
"Well, that's fine, so long as you can still give me a ride to work."
"We can't, we have to meet people in Plano."

OH I DON'T KNOW MAYBE TELL THEM YOU'LL BE LATE TO SEE THEM BECAUSE YOU'RE SEEING YOUR DAUGHTER FOR THE LAST TIME FOR FUCK KNOWS HOW LONG? Yeah. This cements it. I'm only allowing this because I want the last of their shit out of my apartment, but I am fucking done. They're prioritizing my father's fucking coworkers over me.

(And same as last week, waited until the last minute to tell me so I couldn't find a better workaround.)

And I was coming here to complain about the coworker who calls me 'kiddo.'
Sorry your parents suck :/.

Auspice · Dec 15, 2017, 8:19 PM

@lisse24 said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

@auspice said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

"We're running late."
"Well, that's fine, so long as you can still give me a ride to work."
"We can't, we have to meet people in Plano."

OH I DON'T KNOW MAYBE TELL THEM YOU'LL BE LATE TO SEE THEM BECAUSE YOU'RE SEEING YOUR DAUGHTER FOR THE LAST TIME FOR FUCK KNOWS HOW LONG? Yeah. This cements it. I'm only allowing this because I want the last of their shit out of my apartment, but I am fucking done. They're prioritizing my father's fucking coworkers over me.

(And same as last week, waited until the last minute to tell me so I couldn't find a better workaround.)

And I was coming here to complain about the coworker who calls me 'kiddo.'
Sorry your parents suck :/.

Complain away. My bs doesn't diminish your bs at all.

And now they're gone and on the road and I can bitch and stress and go through a week of having all the shit from the past be dredged up to swill around my mind before I drink it back into oblivion again.

(I really need to find a therapist that takes my insurance so I can process the abuse in a healthy way probably.)

Rook · Dec 15, 2017, 8:42 PM

@auspice said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

"We're running late."
"Well, that's fine, so long as you can still give me a ride to work."
"We can't, we have to meet people in Plano."

"Fine, get out, and don't come back."

You missed a perfect opportunity, Auspice. SRSLY. They wouldn't even blink, would instantly know WHY, all delivered with a very concise and apropos statement void of feeling or angst. Which, I hear, is the best way to have those quaint conversations with humans.

Derp · Dec 15, 2017, 8:42 PM

@auspice said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

And now they're gone and on the road and I can bitch and stress and go through a week of having all the shit from the past be dredged up to swill around my mind before I drink it back into oblivion again.
(I really need to find a therapist that takes my insurance so I can process the abuse in a healthy way probably.)

Or. OR, and hear me out here:

You could wrap the bodies in digital camo Duck Tape, ensuring they will never be found.

Options.