Armageddon MUD

[ThugHeaven]

@meg it’s being said like that because there isn’t a context.

So, for example if somehow you didn’t read in the documents that very few people can read or write, and you say “So I read on the message board here in the tavern house Kadius is hiring crafters. I’m going to write a reply...” someone might say in ooc “nobody can read but nobles, Templars and maybe merchant house family members.” Some players might say something like that in character.

Now if you ignore that and go, “Yeah, yeah...so anyway, gonna write this message.” Well there are harsh consequences for a commoner knowing how to read and write.
But what isn’t going to happen. Is the same scenario and you say “Oh shit, I didn’t know that! Sorry!” Nobody is going to bat an eye.

[Meg]

@thugheaven said in Armageddon MUD:

Some players might say something like that in character.

This is ICC for OOC ignorance. Right there. Why do you keep denying that you can get punished for OOC ignorance in one sentence and then reinforcing that it can happen in the next sentence?

Just accept that it's part of your game. And there are people that don't want to play based on that simple fact.

[ThugHeaven]

Players saying something like “Only nobles can read and write.” in character is not a consequence. It’s them not breaking character to tell you the player something. Either way you get the message and it’s no harm, no foul.

It’s not a fact, it’s your misinterpretation of a fact I’m having an issue with.

[Meg]

@thugheaven It is a consequence. It makes your character, who has lived in this world their whole life, seem like a stupid idiot who thinks they can read even though they /should/ know better. It cements it in, because there's no given way to retcon and walk things back, because that other person isn't breaking character to tell you.

I'm not saying this is bad or good. But it is a thing.

ETA: And I am not misinterpreting. I can go back and quote your other posts for you where you said punishments /can/ happen, if you want.

[Sunny]

@thugheaven

@evilcabbage said in Armageddon MUD:

the welcome might be an introduction to being mugged and murdered, or being abused, or being treated lower than low because you're a commoner and that's a templar, but you are being introduced to the world.

[ThugHeaven]

@meg

You don’t have to, I know what I said. In this very clear example, I clarified it right now. There seems to be a misunderstanding there. Now you’re saying a player might feel embarrassed that they made a mistake and they would like a retcon on the whole dialogue?

[Kanye Qwest]

@evilcabbage I think it's fine for newbies to be treated like oldbies and to learn by kind of doing, honestly. I'm just more boggled that anyone would think throwing someone in jail for not bowing randomly = good rp.

What, like, you roll through a room and if not everyone in it types bow you punish them? Scintillating.

[ThugHeaven]

@sunny That goes back to those things happening to you, but not because you’re new.

[Roz]

@thugheaven said in Armageddon MUD:

@sunny That goes back to those things happening to you, but not because you’re new.

The point is that new players are going to be way more prone to making these mistakes because they're still learning. We know it's not "because they're new," that it's because they flubbed an IC thing, but they flubbed the IC thing because they are new.

@thugheaven said in Armageddon MUD:

@meg

You don’t have to, I know what I said. In this very clear example, I clarified it right now. There seems to be a misunderstanding there. Now you’re saying a player might feel embarrassed that they made a mistake and they would like a retcon on the whole dialogue?

Yes, on a lot of games, people would do that, because it feels silly to them that their character would say a dumb thing that makes no sense.

[ThugHeaven]

@roz And that’s when you say “I didn’t know I can’t read. Can we retcon that?” Players would retcon it, no problem.

[Roz]

@thugheaven said in Armageddon MUD:

@roz And that’s when you say “I didn’t know I can’t read. Can we retcon that?” Players would retcon it, no problem.

@thugheaven said in Armageddon MUD:

With that in mind, what you do and don’t do in character is responded to in a manner of ica=icc. Since there isn’t much ooc communication, how would the other player know that you were unaware to bow to them?

So you have two alternatives:

1. You can break character and say “I didn’t know I was supposed to do x.” Most people would allow you that take back. There are still players that wouldn’t though. And that’s because ica=icc. It’s like Dark Souls remember?

[ThugHeaven]

@roz Isn’t the difference between what I said before and what I’m saying now: can we retcon that?

[Roz]

@thugheaven The difference is that what you said before was "Or people might not let you retcon, because it's Dark Souls and ICA=ICC."

Like, just accept the fact that your game is less forgiving when it comes to OOC ignorance -- even if it's gotten better -- and accept that that's a playstyle not many folks on this particular board will be into, as MSB tends to be more focused on MUSH and MUX playstyles.

[ThugHeaven]

@roz Or just accept that I’m advertising the game here because it’s MU soapbox, not Mush/Mux soapbox. Whether people would or wouldn’t be interested isn’t really up to you to decide. It’s for whoever looks at the advertisement. There are people that never played a Mud at all. I’ve already been approached about the game, so job done.

[D-bone]

Let's not also forget that ooc communication is highly discouraged- so some new players might encounter situations where they are told not to take it ooc and keep it ic, so they might be afraid to ask for a retcon. Oh snap, the system is designed to keep new players in the dark and kick the shit out of em. So you know all those games your encouraged to express your needs and desires in the game oocly with the people around you so they know your limits n shit? Fuck that.

[ThugHeaven]

@d-bone

Can you give an example of a player being told to keep it IC?

[D-bone]

You.. play on an RPI, have you never encountered it? It's not a unicorn.

[Roz]

@thugheaven I readily accept that you are advertising on here and that you might get folks interested. But it's aggravating to watch the thread go around in circles instead of just going "Yeah, this is part of the playstyle, if you're not into it probably not the game for you." Instead it's a whole defensive spiral about why the playstyle ISN'T THAT BAD and IT USED TO BE WAY WORSE or something.

[ThugHeaven]

@d-bone No I haven’t, so example please.

[ThugHeaven]

@roz because it’s not. What I keep seeing is “I don’t want to play a game where I can’t make a mistake as a new player” What I’ve done right now is clarified that yes you can and given an example of how you can do that.

So since it’s an advertisement and it doesn’t happen like that. If it keeps coming up, I’m going to keep saying it in different ways until it’s clear that you can make mistakes and the mistake can be taken back.