Development Thread: Sacred Seed

[Apos]

@wildbaboons said in Development Thread: Sacred Seed:

@apos Is Tehom willing to make that more public? I know you'd mentioned it as a dream before but it'd be awesome if the core stuff was made available (the where, bbs, mailing, etc)

Yes, definitely. The problem is that the different commands aren't really in discrete modules that can be broken off very well, and giving everything with the API keys would be really really bad, so it all needs to be refactored and sanitized to be able to make it safely public. That's more of an organizational problem than anything though, so if someone was like, 'so how did you code X' then he could just manually copy and paste that particular stuff and someone might be missing some dependencies but nothing they couldn't work around, I think. Or I could do it, I have the repository also, and I'm happy to if he gives the okay.

[Songtress]

Well, this is amazing and I like it! And I think most people gave all the ideas I wanted to for the moment.

[Songtress]

After a few hours I thought about adapting a character I have, a young woman considered Seedless who's seeded( tentatively choosing the court of Groves(does it exist?)

@

[Coin]

@songtress said in Development Thread: Sacred Seed:

After a few hours I thought about adapting a character I have, a young woman considered Seedless who's seeded( tentatively choosing the court of Groves(does it exist?)

@

Court of Groves no longer exists. There isn't really a "vegetation" element, since we chose to go the "non-living" route for the elements (so no "plant-bending" and "blood-bending").

We're also working on making the Courts more than just "The Court of ELEMENT!" and instead mixing elements to make Courts that can be inhabited by more than one (Storms is Air/Water; Basalt is Earth/Fire; and on and on). However, I can share the preliminaries of what elements (and their specialties) will be available:

Each Element has a basic Seeded--you can be Air-Seeded and do all the basic stuff any Air-Seeded can do, including most of the non-exclusive stuff the more specialized Air-Seeded can do. However, if you do have a sub-element, for example, not just being Air-Seeded but also Spark-Seeded, you get bonuses to any of the techniques and effects that have to do with "lightning" (including things like boosts in speed, and shooting lightning bolts!) but have a comparatively harder time doing things that belong to Frost- or Sky-Seeded. Basic Seeded (who have no sub-element) are more the "generalists" of their element.

Fire

• Vulcan-Seeded - Flame-Seeded with special skills in manipulating plasma.
• Pyre-Seeded - Thermokinetic Flame-Seeded who specialize in raising the temperature, both internal and external.
• Smoke-Seeded - Mystical Flame-seeded who manipulate smoke and can peer through one of the Veils.

Water

• Rain-Seeded - Mystical Water-Seeded who manipulate rainfall, humidity, and can peer through one of the Veils.
• Mist-Seeded - Water-Seeded with control over the gasdeous state of water, masters of stealth and obscurity.
• Ice-Seeded - Cold, aloof Water-Seeded with specialized control over the solid state of water, able to create constructs "out of thin air".

Air

• Frost-Seeded - Thermokinetic Air-Seeded who specialize in lowering the temperature, both internal and external.
• Spark-Seeded - Lightning specialists of an explosive and levinquick nature.
• Sky-Seeded - Mystical Air-Seeded who can fly effortlessly and can peer through one of the Veils.

Earth

• Stone-Seeded - Earth-Seeded with control over granite, rock, and other natural forms of earth.
• Metal-Seeded - Metal-twisting Earth-Seeded with unparalleled skill manipulating all kinds of metals and alloys.
• Jewel-Seeded - Mystical Earth-Seeded who are master-crafters, manipulate the rarer minerals, and can peer through one of the Veils.

There's an effort in giving each element something unique, but also in making them all pretty cool on their own. I'm especially stoked about the Air-Seeded and how their sub-elements are working out.

Keep in mind this is a work in progress and I am posting this while @Cobaltasaurus is asleep and she might smack me when she wakes up!

[Lithium]

@coin It does look like there is some overlap, like with the air thermokinetics and the water ice seeded. Both deal with changing the temperature of ambient particulates. Air and the water moisture in the air... which amounts to almost the same thing.

[Songtress]

Looking good, the question is also -- so now this makes me think about Avatar The Last AirBender and The Legend of Korra ( respectively), and I was trying to not draw comparisons, but what keeps all this stuff seperate, if someone who specifically 'Earth Seeded' (a general seed?) vs someone who is Stone Seeded? ( what's the different?)

Can you have a child of a Water (rain seeded) person and Fire (Pyre seeded) person and so they have control over steam (which might lean towards the mist-seed of water, but they can also raise tempratures?

[Cobalt]

So far we have talked about hybrid seeds, sondunno yet.

also I’d strongly suggest people not put too much effort into characters they wanna play yet. >_> we have a lot for the world we still need to develop and it’s changing as things fall into place.

Also, we’re trying not to be Diet Avatar.

[Songtress]

I know your not , but the comparison might come up, so I am trying to figure out how to keep it from cropping up.

[Cobalt]

@songtress Oh, sorry didn’t mean to come across spicy. There are plenty of comparisons to it and to something from exalted? We’ve just been going back and forth going “nah Too avatar ish”.

[Ominous]

I think the Avatar comparisons are probably going to cling because of the fact that you have limited magic to elemental powers.

[Testament]

This kind of has a Jim Butcher vibe to it insofar that it slightly reminds me of it. I forget the name of the book series, but it was the one where he basically mashed Pokemon and the Roman Legion together. Someone is going to name it and I'm going to feel stupid for forgetting it.

That all said, I'd love there to be some kind of Steel Seed.

[Songtress]

Codex alera is a good call too. Sort of.

I wish court of Groves had survived the Pruning, I think have a bunch of plant mages, who flowers, potions, and herbal knowledge made them a force, I mean it could help to explain the technology levels sort of.

[Cobalt]

Anyone particularly good at data entry, and organizing things in a logical manner? We could use someone willing to put information on the wiki / website for us. We can do it >.> But it'll probably go up slower, and might not be organized in the most readable way.

So if information organization is your jam, hit us up!

[Cobalt]

Various Updates:

• Leaders have been renamed so that their last names reflect their court, and the courts are now composite elements.

  • Sera Agatta Embers (Court of the Blaze - Air + Fire)
  • Amos Embers-Frost (Court of the Glacier - Water + Earth)
  • Sascha Hillside (Court of the Mountain - Air + Earth)
  • Mielle Sands (Court of Basalt - Earth + Fire)
  • Tristan Storm (Court of Storms - Air + Water)

• Thematic definition of elements working together or against each other:

  • Symbiosis: Symbiosis is the phenomenon of two elements working in tandem. This takes a degree of intimacy between the two Seeded, as they must learn each other's magic and energy. It tends to take some training. Two people with elements that naturally work together and begin a training regiment, until they can work their magic in concert with each other. It can happen naturally but usually when two people are emotionally close: Siblings, good friends, or lovers. It can happen naturally when people fall into sync with each other while working magic. Although accidents do happen and occasionally people can fall into Symbiosis when they are fighting... Such as when Elijah Withen challenged Sera Embers for the Throne of Embers, and during their fight their elements fell into concert and they created a firestorm that burnt down the Firelight Arena.
  • Nullification: Nullification is the phenomenon of elements nullifying each other. This can be mutual or one sided. This typically happens when Seeded are fighting. A Stone-Seeded going against a Fire-Seeded might find the sand they have an affinity for suddenly turning to glass and having a harder time to work it. Or a Water-Seeded might douse the flames of a Fire-Seeded, or if the Fire-Seeded is stronger might find their rain turned to scalding mist that they must cool back down before they can use it again. While this typically comes up during hostile combat situations, accident do happen... Magical Friendly Fire Is A Bitch. A Fire-Seeded and a Water-Seeded might not be the best of partners because they might accidentally Nullify each other.

[Coin]

@lithium said in Development Thread: Sacred Seed:

@coin It does look like there is some overlap, like with the air thermokinetics and the water ice seeded. Both deal with changing the temperature of ambient particulates. Air and the water moisture in the air... which amounts to almost the same thing.

I don't really think overlap is a bad thing, personally. Also, you're looking at it from a physics point of view "raising and lowering temperatures" but this is magic--ice is ice.

I think it's important, when dealing with the classical elements (and thus magical elements) not to get bogged down over what it all means if you're talking about actual, real physics. Ice is ice. Cold is cold. Yes, ice is cold, but cold is not necessarily just ice. Some effects might overlap, some might be similar but with variations, etc.

Avatar, Exalted (Dragon-Blooded), Codex Alera, Legend of the 5 Rings, etc., they all have elemental stuff, we're probably pulling from all of it consciously and unconsciously.

[Coin]

@songtress said in Development Thread: Sacred Seed:

Codex alera is a good call too. Sort of.

I wish court of Groves had survived the Pruning, I think have a bunch of plant mages, who flowers, potions, and herbal knowledge made them a force, I mean it could help to explain the technology levels sort of.

There's other shit going on re: plants and vegetation which will probably get worked on once we have certain other things hashed out.

[Cobalt]

@coin said in Development Thread: Sacred Seed:

Avatar, Exalted (Dragon-Blooded), Codex Alera, Legend of the 5 Rings, etc., they all have elemental stuff, we're probably pulling from all of it consciously and unconsciously.

I only know Avatar... I'm more likely unconsciously pulling from:

• Avatar: The Last Airbender / The Legend of Korra.
• The Elemental Assassin series by Jennifer Estep.
• The Elemental Blessings series by Sharon Shinn. (Seriously, I'mma go reread Troubled Waters rn.)

[Coin]

@coin said in Development Thread: Sacred Seed:

@lithium said in Development Thread: Sacred Seed:

@coin It does look like there is some overlap, like with the air thermokinetics and the water ice seeded. Both deal with changing the temperature of ambient particulates. Air and the water moisture in the air... which amounts to almost the same thing.

I don't really think overlap is a bad thing, personally. Also, you're looking at it from a physics point of view "raising and lowering temperatures" but this is magic--ice is ice.

I think it's important, when dealing with the classical elements (and thus magical elements) not to get bogged down over what it all means if you're talking about actual, real physics. Ice is ice. Cold is cold. Yes, ice is cold, but cold is not necessarily just ice. Some effects might overlap, some might be similar but with variations, etc.

Avatar, Exalted (Dragon-Blooded), Codex Alera, Legend of the 5 Rings, etc., they all have elemental stuff, we're probably pulling from all of it consciously and unconsciously.

Also, we're not making the elemental powers like Mage Arcana/Spheres (which was honestly my original intent) but rather limiting them to Techniques/Effects (like just Rotes, or Charms from Exalted). So if an effect makes sense for an element, it'll probably eventually get worked out.

[Carex]

Economically and socially it's really, really, a bad idea to leave outcast nobles alive. If you prune someone you need to remove all ties from them. Have a ritual of forgetting that erases them from all records and burns their belongings.

They need to not only be treated as if they are dead but as if they had never existed in the first place. If you can get away with it just kill them.

If you leave even a hint of noble ties then they have kids those kids might form a rebellion later. You can't have kids popping up taking portions of wealth or land unexpectedly because you let some pruned seedling walk away with an untapped legacy. It's horrible for the stability of the nation.

If you want to incorporate people moving from being a commoner to a noble then have multiple tiers of nobility. A titled and untitled nobility perhaps.

One tier that can inherit land and one that can only be awarded land by a higher noble. Once someone is awarded land they get a title and their offspring can then inherit land.

You don't want just any old commoner who wins the genetic lottery gaining political power. You need a system of gate-keeping.

[Pyrephox]

@carex said in Development Thread: Sacred Seed:

Economically and socially it's really, really, a bad idea to leave outcast nobles alive. If you prune someone you need to remove all ties from them. Have a ritual of forgetting that erases them from all records and burns their belongings.

They need to not only be treated as if they are dead but as if they had never existed in the first place. If you can get away with it just kill them.

If you leave even a hint of noble ties then they have kids those kids might form a rebellion later. You can't have kids popping up taking portions of wealth or land unexpectedly because you let some pruned seedling walk away with an untapped legacy. It's horrible for the stability of the nation.

If you want to incorporate people moving from being a commoner to a noble then have multiple tiers of nobility. A titled and untitled nobility perhaps.

One tier that can inherit land and one that can only be awarded land by a higher noble. Once someone is awarded land they get a title and their offspring can then inherit land.

You don't want just any old commoner who wins the genetic lottery gaining political power. You need a system of gate-keeping.

On the other hand, it sounds like the mage gifts are only kept alive through fairly rigorous breeding and 'fresh' Seeded are often more powerful than those in the noble families. While that's a political threat, it's also a heck of an opportunity to bolster your family's bloodlines. Which might also provide a rationale for not killing Weeded nobles - they're still from a magic rich bloodline, and if they go out and breed with commoners, it might still raise the chance of throwing a fluke down the line that the family can then claim and breed back into the line.

Although the point about needing to control those common-born Seeded is important. If it weren't a persistent MU* setting, I would suggest that being married into a noble family would be required for a common-born Seeded to be fully acknowledged. But with PCs, that's a recipe for trouble, so I'd simply suggest, instead, that common-born Seeded get enthusiastically courted, with an eye to getting them to sign a contract (or whatever the equivalent is) that dedicates their service to a noble house, and that many of these get married off to one of the noble lines, as well, in hopes that their children will inherent the power.