A bit of trouble on Firefly
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@Kestrel I am in no doubt that this guy is a very fine specimen of toxic masculinity. He is a textbook example of the stereotypical basement dweller with a grudge-on, all the ability to be bloody annoying, and none of the ability to figure out what it is he actually wants. Besides showing women admins and coders who's boss, apparently.
Someone else mentioned a ban list to be shared among games. I'm not so keen on that idea for multiple reasons.
One, leopards can change their spots. I did talk with someone who's on GH and SS both and at the time we were still in the belief he'd done nothing on SS, we agreed that no, we weren't going to do anything either. Because it is possible for someone to be a dick on one game but not on another, and witch hunts aren't pretty. Our attitude changed rather fast when the connection to what happened to Kestrel was made, obviously.
Second, leopards certainly can change their names. It'd be practically impossible to keep up. I mean, this guy has been recognised over and over on his behaviour, not on his name or IP.
And third, we're it. This board has proved highly effective in dealing with this dude, as has the Discord groups that many of us are in. We talk. When it's bad enough, we act. And if there's anything to be learned from this mess, it's that we're actually pretty good at connecting dots and dealing with things. We can pat ourselves on the back for that. No one started up the old chestnuts about manning up or dealing with it or keep this private. We've proved that yes, we can in fact band together when necessary. And that makes me a happy musher.
http://keys.aresmush.com -- Come to Chincoteague, we have ponies.
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@L-B-Heuschkel said in A bit of trouble on Firefly:
And third, we're it. This board has proved highly effective in dealing with this dude, as has the Discord groups that many of us are in. We talk. When it's bad enough, we act. And if there's anything to be learned from this mess, it's that we're actually pretty good at connecting dots and dealing with things. We can pat ourselves on the back for that. No one started up the old chestnuts about manning up or dealing with it or keep this private. We've proved that yes, we can in fact band together when necessary. And that makes me a happy musher.
This came up in the PMs I had with this player who continued to proclaim that he hadn't violated any TSS policies. He was already on our watchlist after what happened with Kestrel, and after he was paging me borderline creepy pages about my poly character -- @Kestrel and I were talking about "gut feelings" earlier today, and I didn't trust my gut with my own interactions with the player.
So, this thread helped me narrow in on what was making me uncomfortable, and why his interactions so far on the game had set me on edge. In my conversation with this player before he was asked to depart TSS, I was very pointed with him that the MU* community is just that... a community. If the community takes issues with how you're acting, then maybe you should... change it?
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@GirlCalledBlu said in A bit of trouble on Firefly:
If the community takes issues with how you're acting, then maybe you should... change it?
It's not about fitting in with a community to this guy. It's about dominance.
Which, again, just... how sad must you be if that's the level of power you can take pride in exerting?
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When you look at it, it's all about ego. They don't give a damn if they're allowed back on the game. They don't fucking care if a ban is lifted. All they care about is the power trip and ego boost harassing people gives them.They cling to the thought that they're powerful enough to make people kowtow to them and grovel, beg them not to do whatever it is they're being threatened with, and when they (the power/ego tripping harassers) aren't given what they want their fragile psyches get hurt.
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The thing is, there is likely no conscious logic involved in this sort of behavior. You can’t suss it out because it doesn’t make sense, period. Pinning motivation to it makes you feel better, makes it easier to process, but at the end of the day it isn’t normal, logical behavior and trying to apply healthy brain logic to it doesn’t work any more than it does trying to ascribe human logic to a fish. He is ill, his brain doesn’t work right. Take the steps needed to protect yourself and the community, but don’t try too hard to explain what can’t be explained.
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Of course we're trying to pin motivation to what happens, because it's human nature to want to make something more understandable.
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The DownWithOPP flashbacks from this thread have made me vaguely nauseous.
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I don't buy the 'no conscious logic' thing. Of course there is. A person sits down at a keyboard and types out threats, lays out statements meant to upset people, that is absolutely a conscious choice. Maybe the underlying impulses that drive a person to become like that are debatable (and probably not worth debating as far as what it means to this community) but it's frustrating when people write off choices as being anything other than acts of intention, regardless of whatever compels them.
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I have never known any amount of armchair psychology to be useful to anyone. We're not the ones who are going to solve whatever's wrong with that guy. Best just to keep them out of our lives, imo.
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@SquirrelTalk said in A bit of trouble on Firefly:
I have never known any amount of armchair psychology to be useful to anyone. We're not the ones who are going to solve whatever's wrong with that guy. Best just to keep them out of our lives, imo.
I find it very useful. If I know what's precisely wrong with the kinds of people liable to make my life worse, and I know how to spot early warning signs of their behaviour, then I know how to protect myself.
Did this guy make my life worse? No. Not even a little bit. But there are a million other guys like him out there, and they are everywhere. They're incredibly predictable and not nearly as special as they like to think. It doesn't hurt to go through life with a radar in mind.
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@Kestrel said in A bit of trouble on Firefly:
@SquirrelTalk said in A bit of trouble on Firefly:
I have never known any amount of armchair psychology to be useful to anyone. We're not the ones who are going to solve whatever's wrong with that guy. Best just to keep them out of our lives, imo.
I find it very useful. If I know what's precisely wrong with the kinds of people liable to make my life worse, and I know how to spot early warning signs of their behaviour, then I know how to protect myself.
Did this guy make my life worse? No. Not even a little bit. But there are a million other guys like him out there, and they are everywhere. They're incredibly predictable and not nearly as special as they like to think. It doesn't hurt to go through life with a radar in mind.
Agreed. It's not about fixing him; fixing him is his own problem. It's about making the patterns easier to identify so other people can recognize them.
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@SquirrelTalk said in A bit of trouble on Firefly:
I have never known any amount of armchair psychology to be useful to anyone.
There's a difference between identifying and recognising patterns and behaviours, and trying to cure or diagnose a person.
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@Tinuviel I'm referring more to the people speculating about what he, personally, gets out of it; or whether he's self aware about it. The behavior itself, certainly, identify it; but the underlying issues; wondering about his perspective? It's all just guesswork based on personal perspective.
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@SquirrelTalk said in A bit of trouble on Firefly:
It's all just guesswork based on personal perspective.
I mean, wondering about a person's perspective when they do things is rather important. There might be a whiff of armchair psychoanalysis, but trying to understand "why" is never a bad thing.
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@GreenFlashlight said in A bit of trouble on Firefly:
It's not about fitting in with a community to this guy. It's about dominance.
Which, again, just... how sad must you be if that's the level of power you can take pride in exerting?
It's /very/ sad. But there are some pretty petty people out there. I had my own run-in with this guy on Firefly, not long after Bear warned us about him. Definitely a misogynist. Definitely egotistical. But don't take my word for it!
We were warned about this guy earlier in the day. I'm one of those people who just minds their own business and roleplays, so trolls normally leave me alone. This was not to be one of those times.
Here's how it started. I was working in another window a few hours after a reboot of the game, having logged back in within seconds of the game coming back up (this'll become important in a minute). And then THIS comes in:
YodaGuest pages: Now you can't just hide on your alt to avoid me.
YodaGuest pages: that won't work.--Creepy, in a pathetic kind of way. But alt? What alt? I don't even know this guy! A look at WHO confirms just who he thinks I am: Osiris. Who I am glad to consider a friend.
Player Name On For Idle Doing
A------- 21m 5s 2m
YodaGuest 52m 26s 18s
K---- 1h 8m 7s 7m
A----- 2h 10s 8s
Osiris 3h 6m 45s 5m
M----- 3h 6m 43s 0s
Miranda 3h 7m 11s 3h
There are 7 players connected.YodaGuest pages: If you want to hide this alt might wanna do a better job of avoiding logging in side by side with it. And thus violating your own alt rules xD
--Yup, same old trick I used. I don't like these types, but they don't scare me. Also, I'm busy and distracted, so I'm not in the mood to deal with some MUSH-invading weeb who isn't as smart as he thinks he is. So I'm less than polite on my first 'go away' hint.
Long distance to YodaGuest: M----- has no alt. "But nice try."
YodaGuest pages: Your login is within a second of your staff bit. So to you O----. Nice try.
You paged YodaGuest with 'Which proves nothing, really. Coincidence is an interesting and pervasive thing. But if you want to stalk players and harass them, I'm more than happy to let you speak to staff. I'm sure they'll be glad to know about it.'
From afar, YodaGuest laughs, "Feel free cunt."--Didn't take that long to come out, did it?
YodaGuest pages: they can't do shit, and brought this on their own game.
YodaGuest pages: and onto you as a player. And anyone else who plays here.
YodaGuest pages: so you are welcome to run to staff and cry M-----. You let Osiris to know she can page me anytime. xD
YodaGuest pages: you dumb little cnt
You paged YodaGuest with 'Sounds more to me like you are. Anyway, enjoy being pagelocked.'
M-----(#---) - Page locked.--I quietly let staff know what was going on about this time. Still, I didn't think my hint would end it, and I wasn't wrong. Evidently, someone standing up to him evokes E-Peen waving impulses.
<Newbie> SpockGuest has connected.
SpockGuest pages: Aww that's cute.
SpockGuest pages: Wanna try again bitch?
From afar, SpockGuest gives a little wink to the cunt rag.
SpockGuest pages: Wanna try again?
SpockGuest pages: there are plenty of guest bits for me to page you from.
SpockGuest pages: Since the staff here is shit with code. xD
<Newbie> YodaGuest has disconnected.
From afar, SpockGuest nudges, "Well lil bitch?--Does he bother me? Not much. I've developed a thick skin. But I still don't have time to deal with him all day.
You paged SpockGuest with 'And it's a very simple command, so I can do this all night. Like now!'
M-----(#---) - Page locked.That's about when the +mail spamming started, and staff took their own steps to deal with this clown. He hasn't been seen since, and I can't say I'm sorry. Dealing with people this toxic was bad enough on Fallout: El Dorado.
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@Watcher I'm kinda surprised he didn't have a go at me as well (Miranda). Though I was offline at the time so I would have missed out on having some fun. Hopefully, the steps we have taken will ensure he never sees the light of day on Firefly.
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That man is a leaf on the wind.
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@archon said in A bit of trouble on Firefly:
@Watcher I'm kinda surprised he didn't have a go at me as well (Miranda). Though I was offline at the time so I would have missed out on having some fun. Hopefully, the steps we have taken will ensure he never sees the light of day on Firefly.
He probably knew what he'd get with you, Miranda. He thought I was someone else, someone who'd talk reasonably with him. But I'm not the MUSH head: I don't have any obligation to put up with him.
But I'm glad I could show what anybody's likely to deal with if they get contacted out of the blue!@Kestrel said in A bit of trouble on Firefly:
That man is a leaf on the wind.
He can watch how I snore.
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Tragic. I wonder who laughed at his unsolicited dick pic and started him down this sad, sad road.
