WoD MUSH Comparison?

[Coin]

@Corruption said:

@Coin - If you have Changeling 2.0 I WILL play even if it screws me for time to do RL stuff I want to do. Talk about games I want badly.

My Eldrich werewolf is going really well. I'm having trouble getting into my vampire, which makes me sad because it really is a good character. I may have to let him go to free the slot for someone who'll use it harder tho.

Eldrich = A+++, though. And I'm a jaded Dino, too. Still saying that.

If you find yourself not being able to get into your character, dropping is sensible, as we do have sphere caps.

That said, I did send @mail to everyone in the vampire sphere with things for them to do, so you might wanna check and make sure it didn't time out. If it did, ask Anahid or page me and I will get you the text.

Also, we have upcoming Black Mass, so you might wanna stick around and see if that generates new drive for him.

[Sunny]

@HelloRaptor said:

@Ganymede said:

@HelloRaptor said:

And set their own notes, and judge their own scenes. PVP even.

If it's just about trust, and you trust the people involved, these should be no problem. Maybe they aren't, to you. I personally see it as having to do with shit other than trust, but I appear to be in the minority here.

Sure. Make the +notes public. Make a 'log or it didn't happen' policy. Transparency helps to build trust.

Of course, no. Why do that? Let's just stick to the way we've been doing shit for years, pretending that players can't trust staff, and vice versa.

You're right. All the games should do that. Everyone will be completely reassured and we can all live happily in an ideal paradise. I look forward to the day that the world embraces that ideal, and we can have referees playing on one of the teams they're officiating for. Because as long as they're trustworthy, there's no possible way their direct involvement could influence their calls.

I was a fool to have doubted your vision.

How do you feel about your tabletop ST rolling dice behind a screen vs on the table without a screen?

[Coin]

@Sunny said:

How do you feel about your tabletop ST rolling dice behind a screen vs on the table without a screen?

Seriously. Hell, I had +roll/blind installed on The Reach when I was staffing there, and use it a lot on Eldritch.

Anyone who can't trust me as a storyteller should not play in scenes I run. I will look at your sheet. I will gauge your character. I will roll stuff secretly and ask you to roll blind. I like to keep the suspense as on the table as possible, especially when I'm running horror.

[Insomnia]

And sometimes he'll roll 10 success on 9 dice for everyone to see.

[Ganymede]

@Coin said:

Seriously. Hell, I had +roll/blind installed on The Reach when I was staffing there, and use it a lot on Eldritch.

I eschew rolling blind on a MU*. You're not going to horrify me while I'm sitting around watching Bar Rescue, Sportscenter, or Family Guy. And you're not going to horrify me with written violence or surprises.

[Tempest]

@Coin said:

@Sunny said:

How do you feel about your tabletop ST rolling dice behind a screen vs on the table without a screen?

Seriously. Hell, I had +roll/blind installed on The Reach when I was staffing there, and use it a lot on Eldritch.

Anyone who can't trust me as a storyteller should not play in scenes I run. I will look at your sheet. I will gauge your character. I will roll stuff secretly and ask you to roll blind. I like to keep the suspense as on the table as possible, especially when I'm running horror.

Eh, this is definitely not my cup of tea. Not sure how visible rolls affects anything, and there's a mountain of reasons for why obfuscating rolls is potentially not the greatest idea. (For one, it reminds me of Firan.)

The only (debateably) good thing from hiding rolls is ooc surprise on the player's behalf.

[Sunny]

@Tempest said:

@Coin said:

@Sunny said:

How do you feel about your tabletop ST rolling dice behind a screen vs on the table without a screen?

Seriously. Hell, I had +roll/blind installed on The Reach when I was staffing there, and use it a lot on Eldritch.

Anyone who can't trust me as a storyteller should not play in scenes I run. I will look at your sheet. I will gauge your character. I will roll stuff secretly and ask you to roll blind. I like to keep the suspense as on the table as possible, especially when I'm running horror.

Eh, this is definitely not my cup of tea. Not sure how visible rolls affects anything, and there's a mountain of reasons for why obfuscating rolls is potentially not the greatest idea. (For one, it reminds me of Firan.)

The only (debateably) good thing from hiding rolls is ooc surprise on the player's behalf.

I was very specifically asking about tabletop in person, in which you're sitting around a table with everyone. I am still asking.

When you're playing tabletop, with a few friends around the table, how do you feel about your DM/ST/etc rolling behind the Dungeonmaster's Screen (or any number of other words they use to describe that thing that is sold for almost every game that hides what the DM is doing from the players without hiding their face or making them move from the table).

[Tempest]

@Sunny

I've personally never played a tabletop like that, so I can't actually say, but I feel like I'd prefer seeing. I dunno, I like actually rolling dice and being able to see the result.

But, yeah, sorry, that post was more aimed at @coin but the way the quote works, it just shows your post unless clicked.

[Arkandel]

I never felt the screen was there to allow the ST to cheat - that's not the point. It's for the anticipation, not knowing what that asshole just rolled (or even if he did it to mess with our heads), so it's not about trust in the first place.

On a MU* I couldn't care less how these things are calculated. If I know the ST whether he tells me my character has some crippling Condition because he just pulled it out of his ass or because he rolled something, whether I can see it or not, is irrelevant. It happened - move on.

[Sunny]

@Arkandel said:

I never felt the screen was there to allow the ST to cheat

It's not. But it could very easily be used to cheat. Easily.

[Pony Trolling]

@Arkandel pretty much this. The major difference between a table top DM and an online one, is really knowing them. The screen is pretty much there for anticipation as far as I'm concerned, and keeping things a mystery.

The long and the short of it is this... If my DM is cheating rolls, it's going to be for the interest of story, or for character benefit, either way it's for the enrichment of the game. If he's cheating rolls for any other reason, I will simply walk away and find a different TT to play.

Having had DM's that both cheat rolls, and don't, I'd much prefer a fudged roll every now and again, though sometimes that arrow from the darkness that hits a natural 20, and then a second natural 20, and then a third and results in... "An goblin arrow from the darkness is fired, you are vaporized so hard for no real reason that you cease to exist and your party all takes AOE damage of 3x d6 for bone fragments because wtfsplosions," can be hilarious at times, but leaves your game dead in the water.

[Arkandel]

@Sunny said:

It's not. But it could very easily be used to cheat. Easily.

Well, sure it could, but so what? If I'm surrounded by friends having fun, is it really important if the ST faked a botch to add drama to the scene?

What's important is for me to have fun, not my character. In fact most of the time those two goals are mutually exclusive.

[Ganymede]

@Arkandel said:

What's important is for me to have fun, not my character. In fact most of the time those two goals are mutually exclusive.

Then don't have the ST roll. Let him or her concoct stuff for you to tilt at. There are few players like you or I.

[Sunny]

@Arkandel said:

@Sunny said:

It's not. But it could very easily be used to cheat. Easily.

Well, sure it could, but so what? If I'm surrounded by friends having fun, is it really important if the ST faked a botch to add drama to the scene?

What's important is for me to have fun, not my character. In fact most of the time those two goals are mutually exclusive.

Can someone please explain to me why this does not apply to mushing?

[Arkandel]

@Ganymede said:

@Arkandel said:

What's important is for me to have fun, not my character. In fact most of the time those two goals are mutually exclusive.

Then don't have the ST roll. Let him or her concoct stuff for you to tilt at. There are few players like you or I.

I don't even care how it happens, so as long as they're having fun too, let them figure it out. Some people like @Coin just want to watch the world roll, so that's fine with me too - whatever! Then I've run PrPs where not a single die was rolled (I had a great such scene last night in fact). All that matters is being entertained.

[Derp]

@Thenomain

Possibly! I don't know. It just seems to me that unless you have specific training in those areas, you're not gonna have a clue how to do this. So is it possible? Sure, I guess. Is it going to be possible for your average user who doesn't have a background in programming? Unlikely.

[Coin]

@Arkandel said:

@Ganymede said:

@Arkandel said:

What's important is for me to have fun, not my character. In fact most of the time those two goals are mutually exclusive.

Then don't have the ST roll. Let him or her concoct stuff for you to tilt at. There are few players like you or I.

I don't even care how it happens, so as long as they're having fun too, let them figure it out. Some people like @Coin just want to watch the world roll, so that's fine with me too - whatever! Then I've run PrPs where not a single die was rolled (I had a great such scene last night in fact). All that matters is being entertained.

This is false. I have run myriad plots in which nary a dice was rolled and have even staffed and run major story arcs on diceless games. You, sir, exaggerate.

And sometimes making people roll blind is just a way of making sure knowledge doesn't color their reactions. If they botch a roll and see it, they know they botched it. If they botch a roll and didn't, they know what I tell them, via my pose and storytelling, and that often creates a better scene.

Often. Not always. Subjectively. Not objectively. In before people get up in arms about opinions and assholes.

[HelloRaptor]

@Coin

And sometimes making people roll blind is just a way of making sure knowledge doesn't color their reactions.

Yeah, wouldn't want people we otherwise trust getting unconsciously influenced in their decisions by-

Sorry, choked on the... irony? Hypocrisy? I can never tell which is which these days.

[Coin]

@HelloRaptor said:

@Coin

And sometimes making people roll blind is just a way of making sure knowledge doesn't color their reactions.

Yeah, wouldn't want people we otherwise trust getting unconsciously influenced in their decisions by-

Sorry, choked on the... irony? Hypocrisy? I can never tell which is which these days.

You're so grumpy lately. And in both cases, it's still about trust. See how it's still about the same thing?

Also, dude, give me a fucking break. Not every situation is the same, and not every situation has to be different because of any reason other than we choose it to be. Sometimes I want to be in the scene I'm running. Sometimes I want to keep people in the dark about their rolls. I usually ask if anyone has a problem with either, which I would have told you, if you had asked if I take any steps to make sure people are okay with these aspects of my storytelling, instead of jumping right into being a dick.

It's like you're purposely being obtuse just to be an ass, which is beneath you, because you can usually and very skillfully be a comprehending ass, which is much preferable.

[Ganymede]

@Coin said:

It's like you're purposely being obtuse just to be an ass, which is beneath you * * *.

Dude, what? Are you new here?