Finding roleplay
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I can't say I'm surprised but I am a little saddened that it seems like these days people pretty much ignore the IC grid for spontaneous RP. Maybe it's nostalgia but I feel like some of the best RP back in the day came about wandering the grid.
edit: I want to clarify that I don't mean hanging out in bars or whatever. Just people finding interesting places on the grid and improvising scenes there playing off the environment.
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Oh, I do that. I like a new location here and there, especially if I'm not feeling otherwise inspired. But it's not how I find RP.
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@Ide said in Finding roleplay:
I can't say I'm surprised but I am a little saddened that it seems like these days people pretty much ignore the IC grid for spontaneous RP. Maybe it's nostalgia but I feel like some of the best RP back in the day came about wandering the grid.
edit: I want to clarify that I don't mean hanging out in bars or whatever. Just people finding interesting places on the grid and improvising scenes there playing off the environment.
@Ninjakitten said in Finding roleplay:
Oh, I do that. I like a new location here and there, especially if I'm not feeling otherwise inspired. But it's not how I find RP.
The above. A lot of TLC went into the grid on my game, and it's almost never used. The concept of the 'anywhere room' is far too versatile for a built grid to keep up. I do suspect that built grids become more useful - and more important - as your playerbase gets huge, but generally speaking the setting for my RP these days is negotiated ahead of time. There's still plenty of novelty in there, especially if you propose scenes in a totally spaghetti-at-the-wall way, you never know what someone will latch onto. There's a lot of common overlap, sure, but that was true with built grids too - those bar scenes you explicitly excepted.
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@Ide and @Ninjakitten remind me the last way I find RP:
- Go to a place that seems interesting to me and announce that I'm there.
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I get my best results by straight out asking people. 'Hey, RP?' works quite well. I don't mean a general question in the OOC room though I occasionally do that too but to a specific person either using their name(s) or via page. But I'm forward that way.
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@The_Supremes said in Finding roleplay:
The above. A lot of TLC went into the grid on my game, and it's almost never used. The concept of the 'anywhere room' is far too versatile for a built grid to keep up.
Really? I haven't seen Anywhere Rooms being used for much other than private scenes or backscenes. People tend to RP on grid unless there isn't somewhere on the grid to represent where they want to be.
Having said that, private scenes seem to be becoming the rule rather than the exception. I think that has more to do with the use of Anywhere Rooms than any versatility (or lack thereof).
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@Thenomain said in Finding roleplay:
See, in the days before PrPs, people would either get together and have something happen and that leads to something else happening and so on or so forth, or staff would. I do not like the concept of PrPs for reasons above, but to re-state in this context are because they seem to be formulaic and that's not what I'm into.
This ... will always be a PrP to me, a plot run by players for themselves and friends in lack of staff plots, or in place of when staff plots are usually not going when I play.
The current PrP more seems to be players assuming ST like positions in light of fewer staff on places in general it seems.
I usually go out and start rping, developing PrPs on the fly in response to what others and my own PC seem to be doing. Getting them into trouble and, sometimes, getting them out of it.
RP seems to come with enough effort without having to spend too much time seeking it.
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@Thenomain said in Finding roleplay:
@ThatOneDude said in Finding roleplay:
But if you don't go to events, what do you do in RP?
Rescue damsels, fight monsters, spend my loot on ale and whores. The same kinds of things that you do during events, only without the pressure that we're on a time crunch and that the Plot Must Be Resolved.
Ummm.... how is that different from a PrP? Seems to fit the textbook definition to me? Not nitpicking, just genuinely curious since you seem to be so anti-PrP.
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There is a certain banality to PRPs and events, a certain lack of organic development, which I think is what Thenomain is referring to.
It used to be that things didn't need to be scheduled days ahead of time; staff could drop in and run something randomly, with the people avialable; storylines between people led to plot because of the storyline, not the other way around; stuff like that.
It's easy to see where the distinction can be lost on some people, but others find it very different to play into a story that develops organically from the actions, inactions, and circumstances the characters find themselves in day in and day out, than they do playing a story that is essentially prepared: "guys, this Saturday we are going to have plot. It will be plot. Things with happen."
I have had people complain when I bill an event as something social and then drop plot into it, because "I wasn't really ready for a PRP tonight" or "if I knew there was going to be combat I would have brought my other PC" or "this isn't what I thought it would be" or...
Conversely, I've had people be disappointed because a PRP was not actually what they expected, either: "my character can't do anything because this is combat and he can't fight" or "what am I here for? my character is a two-dimensional brawler and this is clearly an investigation scene" or "I was promised a fight, why is everyone talking" or "this said LOW DANGER why are my extremely antagonistic actions leading to my inevitable death at the hands of understandably pissed off NPCs?" or...
And so on, and so on.
At least, the way @Thenomain says he likes it, there are no expectations other than what we create during play; there are no high risk/low risk separations, there are no social/combat separations, anything can happen because it's not something designed to be fit into a category and scheduled to happen at a certain time for a certain amount of time.
I like both styles, frankly; I think they both have their place. But it's absolutely true that one style has completely taken over the hobby, leaving the other as a rare, endangered practice we're all too old to really push forward with.
"Excuse the hell out of you. He's a bag of dicks. I'm a carefully curated box of cocks." -- to @GirlCalledBlu upon being misrepresented.
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@Coin said in Finding roleplay:
I like both styles, frankly; I think they both have their place. But it's absolutely true that one style has completely taken over the hobby, leaving the other as a rare, endangered practice we're all too old to really push forward with.
Yeah, this. For starters though anyone who'd complain because someone else threw unexpected plot - as long as it's not terribly unthematic of course - on 'their scene'? Oh no, things are happening instead of being in a barely glorified bar scene in which nothing happens!
... Anyway.
What I like about the presence of a Storyteller running a PrP is the idea there is a point to it; either self-contained or part of a series, there is an identifiable story being told. It was introduced, characters get to witness it unfold and it will hopefully have a resolution. Those are not all elements one necessarily gets to experience in organic 'normal' RP.
On the other hand of course it's always fun when stories just... happen. Sometimes I've had a blast because chemistry was just right and while surrounded by creative players we generated very high quality roleplay; I hold my days in HM's VampSphere with the Carthians very highly in that regard, for example.
It's likely criticism to either kind of plot-running can be traced back to doing it badly. Either the 'story' involved is shoved down people's throats ('you will fight orcs and you will LIKE it'), someone enriches a scene with me-me stuff that derails ongoing roleplay when it was already working just fine ('my character comes in bleeding, won't someone bring him back from the brink of death? Oh, you were busy before? too bad, now you're dealing with me'), but I think what still must be said is that even those frustrating examples are still better than idling. I'd be quite grateful to the silly ST who runs one of those self-contained PrP which is 95% combat with a 5% excuse for it than sit there stalking +who trying to find RP.
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A lot of the time when I've attempted to--or seen someone else attempt to--drop some plot into a scene, what I see afterwards (or in pages, if I'm not the one doing it) is: "we were just fine having our scene, why did they have to come in and derail us with their stupid plot shit?"
And I'm like--sigh, because you can probably have that scene whenever and I can run this right now? Or, alternatively, because that's how life is.
On the other hand, some people drop some really fucking lame shit, and that's pretty subjective.
It's a crapshoot, is what I'm saying.
"Excuse the hell out of you. He's a bag of dicks. I'm a carefully curated box of cocks." -- to @GirlCalledBlu upon being misrepresented.
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@Coin The idea of being anything but grateful to someone willing to come in and volunteer to run things for me makes no sense. Unless it's an absurdly bad or implausible plot there's only one valid response to that and it's "thank you".
The other reason for it is that if the scene is public anyone can come in and 'derail' it. If people want to do their thing just grab a temp or private room, sheesh.
But I'd guess the same players will still bitch the next day because nothing ever happens and they're bored.
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@Coin said in Finding roleplay:
Conversely, I've had people be disappointed because a PRP was not actually what they expected, either: "my character can't do anything because this is combat and he can't fight" or "what am I here for? my character is a two-dimensional brawler and this is clearly an investigation scene" or "I was promised a fight, why is everyone talking" or "this said LOW DANGER why are my extremely antagonistic actions leading to my inevitable death at the hands of understandably pissed off NPCs?" or...
This one irks me to no end. Some people just seem to shut down if it turns into something that might not be a moment they had designed their character around. These are the times where the creativity of a player can really shine! I like when a player throws something completely random out there and the whole room picks it up and runs with it. That sort of completely organic excitement simply cannot be planned and tends to be some of the best plot starts.
@Arkandel Agreed. If the style of a person running the plot clashes with what you enjoy, the polite thing to do is still to thank them for the time and effort and just keep it in mind when choosing your RP down the line. Personally, I'm at a point where I avoid the grand "on rails" plots that some toss out there with pre-written endings.
Whining in the room is never okay. If you aren't down with something, find a way to work it out constructively or pose out politely. You get back what you put out there.
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Coin got it. Where I play, a PrP has become systemized. There is an expectation that it have a point, an ending, or at the very least a risk/reward setup. Some people are good at winging it, but the last five years in the realms of WoD that's been discouraged.
I think we're seeing a reversal of that, but I still see the letters "PrP" and cringe.
“If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe.”
― Carl Sagan, Cosmos -
@Thenomain said in Finding roleplay:
Coin got it. Where I play, a PrP has become systemized. There is an expectation that it have a point, an ending, or at the very least a risk/reward setup. Some people are good at winging it, but the last five years in the realms of WoD that's been discouraged.
I think we're seeing a reversal of that, but I still see the letters "PrP" and cringe.
I kind of hate it too, really. I'd much rather just do something organically in the moment than have to plan every little detail of something out, make it open to everyone who wants to come, try and work on scheduling and crap. It's terrible.
Racism isn't Tinkerbell. It doesn't need you to believe in it for it to exist.
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@Derp said in Finding roleplay:
@Thenomain said in Finding roleplay:
Coin got it. Where I play, a PrP has become systemized. There is an expectation that it have a point, an ending, or at the very least a risk/reward setup. Some people are good at winging it, but the last five years in the realms of WoD that's been discouraged.
I think we're seeing a reversal of that, but I still see the letters "PrP" and cringe.
I kind of hate it too, really. I'd much rather just do something organically in the moment than have to plan every little detail of something out, make it open to everyone who wants to come, try and work on scheduling and crap. It's terrible.
The flipside of it is people whose schedules, socialization skills or plain newbie status prevents them from being organically part of interesting scenes which grow to be more. Organized +events give them an in, and from then on they can cultivate IC relationships, show off their RP chops to people and gain hooks into the game's theme. Sometimes a STed PrP let me grow my still generic 'grumpy cop' into a legitimate more three dimensional character.
- He who takes offense when not intended is a fool. He who takes offense when intended is a greater fool.
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Like I said, in my opinion, they both have their place; it's the propagation of one and extinction of the other that's the issue.
"Excuse the hell out of you. He's a bag of dicks. I'm a carefully curated box of cocks." -- to @GirlCalledBlu upon being misrepresented.
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@Arkandel said in Finding roleplay:
The flipside of it is people whose schedules, socialization skills or plain newbie status prevents them from being organically part of interesting scenes which grow to be more. Organized +events give them an in, and from then on they can cultivate IC relationships, show off their RP chops to people and gain hooks into the game's theme. Sometimes a STed PrP let me grow my still generic 'grumpy cop' into a legitimate more three dimensional character.
This was my issue back when more random events were more common on games I played. They never seemed to happen when I was online, or would be in progress and have started an hour ago, when I was still at work. My only objection to somebody dropping something on me would be that I sometimes only have a couple hours a night to RP, and if a random scene happens when I've just got an hour left, it'll probably be less frustrating for everyone concerned to just beg it off.
I am sad the practice has died, though. It at least shows an ST is trying, even if they aren't dropping stuff I'm 100% in the mood for or can participate in, and I appreciate the effort.
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If I feel nostalgic about something was player-ran spheres. The need to go out and recruit others to your political cause or bend them toward your agenda is such a potent roleplaying-creation tool. When the more established characters have to get out of their rooms to influence hearts and minds and every new character is an unharvested vote for the next meeting what you end up with is a perpetual scene making machine.
Unfortunately such environments certainly have their issues. Rank-chasing turns mostly reasonable people into frothing idiots, over-active players can dominate things simply on the merit of being online 24/7, it encourages the creation of insular cliques and it often devolves into OOC drama if left unmanaged.
But damn, when it works it works really well.
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Both the games I play on have RP channels for finding RP, so I typically will go on the RP channel and go hello I would like to RP if I don't have anything scheduled. Usually someone will bite, but if no one does I'll go play video games.
I'm not sure why everyone's so down on hanging out on OOC channels. What else am I gonna do at work? WORK? Please.
