@ghost I have to admit, I find myself agreeing with you more today than I have in years. Thank you for saying a lot of what I've been thinking and haven't been able to articulate.

I've rarely had chars outright die, but I always seem to lose them long before I consider their story done. Sometimes, (not all the time, just sometimes,) I have someone where I can do private RP outside the game, exploring the what-ifs or the last of the story until something new replaces it. Not all the time, though.

The rest of the time, I let myself grieve because stories get a little too real to me and losing them is HARD.

@Ghost Look. You keep defending Spider, but numerous people brought evidence. They brought logs. They brought anecdotes. The staffers came in and told their tale.

None of that happened in a vacuum. If you need to defend someone, (in my opinion,) pick a better subject. Spider is a lot of the reason why I want evidence before I'm willing to ban someone. I've seen too many people hounded off a game because Spider decided they were doing something wrong and told Spider's in-crowd. (Edited to fix pronouns.)

@Macha I've been through this. When you need to, take off to the bathroom or someplace private, have a few minutes of tears or whatever, then go back to work. Rinse, repeat. Then go home and have a good shower and a big cry. Rinse, repeat ad nauseum.

You can do this. For me, it helped to remember that the Victorians used to have a two or three year period where you were /expected/ to grieve intermittently, it's part of the wearing of black for that time period. We don't allow ourselves enough time to properly grieve in this day and age.

I'm sending virtual hugs.

The thing about VASpider is this: she's friendly, cheerful, personable, charismatic, helpful, kind, and will run lots of plot for you.

That's how she gets her minions. And staff friends.

And she's that way for a good long time, up until one day, someone does something that upsets her or she feels like she's been thwarted or she just feels like overturning the apple cart. And if she doesn't have any visible enemies, she'll turn on one of her own, and get all her minions to do the same. And suddenly, that person is being targeted with no clue why.

Sound familiar to anyone here? All of you people claiming that wanting evidence is evil? You're absolutely wrong. Because Spider had a way of making it so that even asking for the logs was 'mistrusting' her. And if you think other people won't do the same thing...well, I've watched it happen on other games.

"People are complaining," says Staffer A to the headwiz. They don't mention WHICH people. Just people. The headwiz decides to take action and come down hard on the person that "people" are complaining about without ever asking for evidence because Staffer A is trustworthy. Thing is, it's not "people." It's just Staffer A, who's having a bad day or a bad year or a bad life, or isn't getting enough attention that week, whichever. But because that staff is a closed circle and an echo chamber, no outside dissent comes into it.

Always ask for evidence. Trust, but verify. Don't assume that because someone is your friend, they're entirely objective and unbiased.

@GreenFlashlight And again, we have this argument.

Bring. Receipts. Is. Not. A. Bad. Default.

I don't know you from Adam, you could be a liar of the highest order. How do I know this? I've run afoul of VASpider and her at-the-time coterie and they sure as hell did a number on me on her say-so. For over two years. So you may not trust authority but I don't trust a mob mentality OR authority, even when the authority is mine. I second-guess myself so much that I annoy people and myself.

It's not about litigation, it's about bringing ANY kind of evidence.

Also, the people no longer welcome on this board are the ones who want to bring the personal attacks. Personally, I want to hear from the people who've been scared into silence for the last few years.

I'm just going to come out and say it: @Nymeria. You are indeed racist and it shows. You're proving it by word and deed.

To quote Maya Angelou, "When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time."

You've been showing us for years.

@greenflashlight I can provide one.

The argument over wanting evidence to ban someone on a game, even minimal evidence. There were a great number of those that were banned who were arguing that no evidence was needed, believe victims wholesale just because they said it.

Derp came down on the side of "Uh...that's not ok." (So did I, so did a number of people who I'll not name out of courtesy.)

Derp was the only one who was told what a terrible, misogynistic, evil rape apologist he was for wanting basic facts. But a HUGE percentage of people who were arguing it did it. What is that but brow-beating, name calling, and bullying?

No one called me a rape apologist for saying believe-but-verify. Why is that, do you think?

As long as there's a place that sells cabbages.

No one's mentioned this yet, but Knives Out was a fantastic amount of fun for anyone who's ever vaguely liked Agatha Christie type mysteries. The cast is phenomenal, the acting is brilliant, and several of the cast seem to be having the "I'm getting PAID for this? This job is the BEST!" kind of time in their roles.

@Ghost I had to catch up on The Mandalorian before I let myself read this.

That is...really uplifting. I did not hate Jar Jar Binks, personally, although my favorite headcanon is that he was a Sith using a form of Drunken Monkey Kung Fu. It puts a whole new twist on everything he does. But man, no one hates like a Star Wars fan.

In the tabletop vein...I was 19, and playing a superhero character that had a VERY small level of fame as a rising singer.

GM brings in this Juggernaut ripoff character and I think, what the hell. My char flies up, and I have the GM roll to see if he recognizes me. There's like a 6% chance that he does.

He does. Not only does he, but he's a fan. (It was a very good roll...for me.)

I kinda derailed the entire evening's combat in one roll, it's the only time in my life I ever did. And it was fun watching the GM's brain absolutely shut down in shock.

My other fun story was a different GM: it was GURPS and I claimed my char had area knowledge. He was like, "How does she know the area?" I thought about it and said, "She knows where all the malls are." (This was back in 1991. Malls were still a thing.) He disbelieved.

I told him to start naming landmarks in the area. He would. I'd tell him how to get there because of what mall it was near and how to get to that mall and then, by extension, to said landmark. I'd only been driving for about six months or so, but my mom had loooooved to go to shop, so it was a thing I could do: navigate that entire area via mall. Before I even learned how to drive.

Thanks, Mom!

@hobos @Hella
I see what you guys are saying. However, my take on it is this: @Derp was directly addressing Cobalt when he said what he said. It was a reminder.

I'm not asking what happened, because for me, what's telling is this: Cobalt came on, saw people were asking questions that dared to question her integrity, flailed around, yelled "how dare you!" and pre-banned four of us from any future games. And missed the point that she pulled something that entirely lacked integrity and didn't apologize for it.

Whatever happened in the past? Don't know, don't care. What's going on NOW is that Macha got raked over the coals based on HER past reputation from a bunch of people who don't like her and reportedly, is continuing to be targeted by said people, in spite of the fact that the person she was RPing with is a known bad actor and was pulling some shady shit. And somehow, she's still the bad guy?

And you guys are worried about Cobalt? Y'all don't need to worry about her, clearly she's got a teflon reputation at this point because no one is pointing out that the banning someone over a consensual scene and then closing of that game is pretty PHB territory. This isn't even me pointing out past misjudgements on her part, I can't be arsed to remember them. This is me looking at what's going on NOW and thinking it's pretty shitty.

@hobos
Just as a note:
conjecture: an opinion or conclusion formed on the basis of incomplete information.
accusation: a charge or claim that someone has done something illegal or wrong.

The last game of Cobalt's that I know I played on for certain was Darkwater and so long ago that it was several computers ago, I have no receipts. Any opinion I advance about Cobalt would have no evidence, just personal anecdotes. Anything I said would have to be conjecture, I have no logs. So I've kept my mouth shut because no logs = no proof.

But let's be fair, just that pre-banning of @Ganymede for...what? is enough to make me wonder what other bad decisions are being made. And Macha's logs showed that a) she was being slut-shamed and b) it was a consensual log that she was being shamed for and is still being shamed for.

Pretty sure that the bad decisions aren't the ones being made here.

@Cobalt I haven't played on any of your games in years. Not worth my time to get attached to a character when you're going to close it in three months anyway.

@Cobalt Thanks for your opinion, I'll continue to go by my own. I have not weighed in on my opinion about your actions, or indeed, anyone's. I'm fairly sure you wouldn't want my unvarnished opinion of any of this.

That said, I do think you need to learn the difference between calling out an action and calling someone a name. There is, in fact, a difference.

Have a good night!

@Cobalt

It's calling out an action, not a personal attack. Do you really not see the difference?

@Bessarion said in Ruiz:

And I'm done giving your dysfunctional ass attention. Just stop.

(Bold is mine) That's a personal attack. Please stop.

@Tez said in The Pack Discussion:

Questionable actions can be called out.

You answered your own question.

Thread resurrection!

Today is gamebook day! I was sent a copy of Werewolf: The Forsaken by a close friend who's divesting himself of his hardcopy.

For further squee, my Avatar Legends Kickstarter stuff arrived today. (This is Last Airbender, not Blue People.) And it's the main book, the adventure guide, the cloth map, the Combat Action deck, the dice and the dice bag! (Ok, at this point, I'm boasting.)

But it's nice to be having a Good Day. (And in March, gods willin' and the crick don't rise, the Old Gods of Appalachia stuff will ship.)