Posts made by Seraphim73

I think that if someone is a jerk in real life, they are almost certain to be a jerk online, but if someone is a jerk online, there is only a slightly higher chance that they are a jerk in real life than if they aren't a jerk online.

I agree with @Roz in particular that not treating online interactions as "real" is a warning sign, but I also think that in some cases it's the result of just not thinking things through rather than a conscious choice to treat other people as lesser because you can't see them. That being said, in most cases, I think it's just treating people as lesser because you can't see them.

Also: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GIFT

@mr-johnson I would suggest focusing the Jedi/Republic side on a single capital ship (probably an Inexpugnable because a Hammerhead is still relatively small -- only 12 fighters, although the 400 passengers would be fine), so that they can move between various locations, which could them be built out of just 2-3 rooms as necessary (unless they're in orbit over an Indy world or something like that). I would suggest the same for the Sith when they come into play. If the Indy characters are all tied into the war in some way (and they really, really, really should be), then they'll have excuses to visit whatever world the Sith/Republic are over. You can also use Indy worlds (or slightly-behind-the-front-lines Republic or Sith worlds) for R&R periods and for RP with associated Indies.

There are definitely downsides to this plan (people tend to turtle up in their ships for RP and not branch out, but that's a culture thing that hopefully could be countered), but I think it's better than basing the "War Factions" on planets and then having to come up with excuses as to why they're involved in offenses across the sector/galaxy.

Whichever method you go with, I would strongly, strongly suggest focusing on a single sector of the Galaxy. I might suggest either the slice of space along the Hydian Way and just galactic northwest of Mandalorian Space (Arkania, Taris, Serenno, Yavin) or the slice directly galactic south-east of it, along the Perlemian Way (Feluccia, Rhen Var, Lantilles, Tanaab). Korriban and Dromond Kaas are right in between those two, as is Mandalorian Space.

@mr-johnson Yeah, that's why I was suggesting just putting 2-3 options per faction on the wiki, probably with short descriptions of what they do and how, along with the steps to create them.

There's probably some way to create an object that can copy a sheet from an NPC stored somewhere onto a PC's sheet, but that's way more coding than I at least have any idea how to do.

Collapsible branching on the wiki is certainly doable... like for the example I posted, there could be a couple of options for skills, there could be an option for pistols vs rifles, and there could be an option for More Damage (Weapon Spec) vs Works Well With Others (Comrades in Arms). All of that would be under the basic "Republic Soldier PC," who would be presented alongside the "Republic Pilot PC," "Lightsaber Jedi Padawan PC," and "Force Power Jedi Padawan PC." My only concern would be that branching options once again introduces complexity that just "enter these commands, choosing my own gender, height, weight, and second language of choice" does not.

@bobgoblin I agree that it would be great to be able to have like "ranged or melee" and the game choose your feats/talents for you based on that (or even branched: Ranged > Rifles > Teamwork-focused). Pretty sure that would be relatively deep on the code-intensive side of things, especially with Dahan-code. Not being a coder myself, I was just offering up a no-code solution.

Example for wiki-posting to help people create a simple Level 3 Republic Soldier:

+physical/set age=adult
+physical/set gender=<choice>
+physical/set species=Human
+physical/set Height=<choice>
+physical/set Weight=<choice>
+chargen/next
.
+ability/set Str=13
+ability/set Dex=15
+ability/set Con=14
+ability/set Int=12
+ability/set Wis=12
+ability/set Cha=11
+chargen/next
.
+select soldier
+spend language=<choice> (see '+spend language=help' for options)
+spend skill=Perception
+spend skill=Initiative
+spend skill=Endurance
+spend skill=Mechanics
+spend skill=Knowledge: Tactics
+spend feat=Point Blank Shot
+spend feat=Weapon Focus: Rifles
+spend talent=Weapon Specialization: Rifles
+level up
.
+select soldier
+spend bonus=Precise Shot
+level up
.
+select soldier
+spend talent=Armored Defense
+spend feat=Trench Warrior

That gets you a character sheet that looks generally like:

Medium Human soldier 3
Force 6
Init +8; Senses Perception +7
Languages Basic, <choice>
-========================================================================-<
Defenses Ref 16 (flat-footed 14), Fort 17, Will 14
hp 48; Threshold 17
-========================================================================-<
Speed 6 squares
Melee by weapon +4
Ranged by weapon +5
Base Atk +3; Grp +5
-========================================================================-<
Abilities Str 13, Dex 15, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 11
Talents Armored Defense, Weapon Specialization (rifles)
Feats Armor Proficiency (light, medium), Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Trench Warrior, Weapon Focus (rifles), Weapon Proficiency (pistols, rifles, simple weapons)
Skills Endurance +8, Initiative +8, Knowledge (tactics) +7, Mechanics +7, Perception +7

Is it the best character ever? Nope. It is a solid one though, and one that doesn't have much in the way of complicated mechanics (precise shot and armored defense are actually in there specifically to remove the complication of several mechanics, although Armored Defense admittedly won't come into play for 2 levels with Light Republic Armor).

It's also a relatively simple way to get someone through chargen, they can easily cut and paste. 1-2 options for each org/sub-org (Jedi and Republic Military would definitely want different builds available) and you can get people who aren't familiar with Saga into play quickly, and let them customize their characters from there as they level.

@mr-johnson I think that it's totally fair to have a scene with a predetermined ending, so long as a) all of the players know it going into the scene, and b) there are lots and lots of things that provide lots of things to react to (plus time and space to react) and preferrably things to do during the scene.

So if they're at Malachor V, then they could totally be in a fight out at the edge of the system, fighting Mandalorians and kicking butt... they just can't impact the big event that will impact them all at the end of their own boarding action/starfighter combat. Lots for people to do, and they still get to show their characters' reactions to Malachor V "on-screen."

I think it's eminently doable, but I also completely understand where you're coming from.

@auspice said in A New Star Wars game? (Legends of The Old Republic (Name pending)):

Tho I still want mandos.

There are still plenty of Mandos scattered around. Just fewer of them, and there's a bigger bad on the block. Could even be a few mercing for the Republic to get back at the Revanchists.

@mr-johnson Disappointed, but totally understood. Still looking forward to the game.

@prototart said in Game Restarts:

I can't actually think of any games that decided to restart that actually, like, started again after it was decided to restart

A Moment in Tyme went through... 3? 4? restarts over the decade that I played there.

@bob said in A New Star Wars game? (Legends of The Old Republic (Name pending)):

As someone who staffed in Age of Mortals which did implement the time skip/new plot location a couple of times I will say that I don't think its ideal. Overall it disrupts personal stories (so most MU) and the handing out of levels, gear, and such due to timeskip sounds logical but it further disrupts things and then adds the administrative headache of people wanting to redo portions of the advancement because they wind up not liking their initial choice

I would strongly recommend against any particular advancement during the timeskip. I still love the idea of 6 months of play to set up personal history between characters who are going to be on different sides, skipping an IC year, and then really playing in the Jedi Civil War, but I recognize that some of the ideas that I like the most... don't go over well with the MU*ing community as a whole.

@thenomain said in A New Star Wars game? (Legends of The Old Republic (Name pending)):

I think if you are 100% Up-Front about it, then you can do it.

If you do choose to run the time-skip, I think this would be CRITICAL. Big bold letters in the MotD and on the wiki about how the Mandalorian Wars section is a prologue and there will be a one-year timeskip with no sheet advancement (except maybe some DSP for the Sith-side) in between.

Well, assuming that the game isn't going with the "every Jedi who fought in the war went with Revan and became Sith" angle because it limits who can join in on the first part of the game, I think that around 6 RL months is just about right for setting up the end of the Mandalorian War (with Jedi/Republic, Indy, and Mando as the three factions) and then time-skipping a year to having Jedi/Republic, Indy (including surviving Mandos), and Sith as the three factions as the Sith come back to the Galaxy and the Jedi Civil War begins. That allows new Jedi/Republic players to either be those who originally stayed home, or those who fought peripherially with the Revanchists if they want, but probably not with the main fleets.

I think if you try to play through the whole Mandalorian War, you're going to lose focus from where it sounds like you want it: the Jedi Civil War. Plus, 4:1 time is harsh, and gets awkward if there aren't plots often enough (especially the big events, and at 4:1 time, in 6 months you'd get half the Mandalorian war).

@mr-johnson No no, I think setting it at the end of the Mandalorian Wars is kind of brilliant. Give it like 6 months there, and then skip ahead a year to the return of the Revanchist. Gives 6 months to make connections between PCs and to get the L3-4s up closer to Prestige Classes. Then you get the fall toward Sith Apprentice of those with Revan, and the 'but we didn't really want war,' and 'what the heck happened to our friends' from those who stayed with the Order. As @GirlCalledBlu noted, it's storytelling gold.

@tinuviel Right, by the end of the Mandalorian Wars, there were almost no Taung left, and they were on their way into extinction. But from my understanding, there were still lots of Taung at the start of the Mandalorian Wars -- but most everything I remember about the era is from Wookieepedia.

@tinuviel During the Mandalorian Wars, quite a few are Taung, actually, including Mandalor the Ultimate. This was, of course, the era where the Taung began accepting Mandalorians besides themselves or a few others.

@mr-johnson If it's Dahan's Saga code, there should be a meetme command built in.

@mercutio Yeah, if you want your Jedi to get involved in the Mandalorian War, by canon they have to be Revanchists (heck, all of the Revanchists became Sith by canon, but you can change that). Then again, don't you want PCs to be the type who intervene rather than sitting by the sidelines? Even if they intervene peacefully?

I would have no problem requiring PCs to not be the type who sit around the temple debating philosophy while the galaxy burns. But I also think that there are a lot of options for why a character might become a Revanchist besides "I want to kill Mandos," and chargen staff can help them find those options.

@faraday The Old Republic Era definitely has fewer fans than the Movie Era, but it was the setting for two very popular video games and a very popular MMO -- it has a lot more name cache with most possible players than say... 1,000 years after The Old Republic (when there really is absolutely nothing going on by canon).

@mr-johnson said in A New Star Wars game? (Legends of The Old Republic (Name pending)):

@mercutio The thing is, there's a big part of me that wants to focus on the people who did have a reason to be a part of the Mandalorian war, make the game more focused by requiring characters to have some connection to the war. I think by having everyone having picked a side one way or another or just plain being connected to it you've got some built in plot hooks right off the bat. But that's just me.

Yes. Yes. Please. Tie the characters together as neatly as possible. Even if they're all on different sides, make it so that all the characters have an explicit tie to the war, so they all care about events there. The smuggler who wants absolutely nothing to do with the war and ignores it? Is going to be ignoring most of the other PCs too, which is not good.

@mercutio said in A New Star Wars game? (Legends of The Old Republic (Name pending)):

@lithium
You run into unfamiliarity issues. And often, people do want to be part of some of the amazing scenarios brought in with the timeline.

Agreed entirely. Familiarity to theme is very, very important.

@auspice My go-to Rhost guy with a copy of a relatively fresh database has a new baby, so...

Between @GirlCalledBlu and I, we can probably help build/desc some grid-rooms, I'm happy to run plots as a player, but I too would very much want to be a player, not a Staffer.

ETA: Blu also loves working on wikis, so if you want some help on that front, let me know.

@mercutio said in A New Star Wars game? (Legends of The Old Republic (Name pending)):

Might I recommend a 3-5 or 5-8 split? Lower the 'distance' between the 'low' and the 'high' of initial application. 8 is a typical choice for the prestige classes it brings. So it depends on what kind of game you want to run off the get-go; a heroic higher level romp, or a start-from-nothing type.

I'm a fan of starting at 4 because it lets you get your first attribute boost (and theoretically your first cross-class skill if you boost your Int and have multiclassed) but still allows you to get your first level or two relatively quickly. 3 and 5 work too, I just think that 4 is the sweet spot between being a character with more than 1 trick and not being too complicated to create. Totally get what you're saying about narrowing the level gap between most starting characters and "leaders" though.

@wildbaboons said in A New Star Wars game? (Legends of The Old Republic (Name pending)):

If I may offer another suggestion.. have some preconfigured kits/builds that people can choose from at chargen

I really like this idea. It might even be something that's done wiki-side rather than code-side, at least at first. A couple of experienced Saga players could create some generic "Republic soldier," "Republic pilot," "Mandalorian Rifleman," "Smuggler," and "Jedi Padawan" builds, and then the commands to create them in chargen could be listed on the wiki. Sure, it would be a slightly-long list, but it would allow players to create basic characters without digging into the books much. I would be -happy- to contribute to such a project.

Along the lines of Chargen, I would strongly suggest not allowing random attribute rolls, and just providing somewhere around 28-30 build points in chargen. With random attribute rolls, there's the equivalent of a 2-3 level disparity if you have a 40-50 point roll instead of the default 25ish build points, even if you're technically starting at the same level.

On a note related to @Mr-Johnson's idea of allowing people to play the default NPCs as PCs... man, those default NPCs are weak weak weak. You'll probably want some "elite" Sith Trooper, Sith Acolyte, Republic Soldier, Mandalorian Neo-Crusader, and Jedi Padawan NPCs with CLs around the level of starting characters. Otherwise it's going to be very, very difficult to challenge PCs.

I like the idea of starting off with a bang in the Mandalorian Wars (being around the edges of Malachor V would be intense for a Force Sensitive). Technically, that would make any Jedi at game-start end up Sith, because except for the Exile, all of the Revanchists went with Revan and Malak. That's totally something that could be changed, and if you have the starting Jedi split into Sith and Jedi... there are some awesome possibilities for personal connections once a portion of them fall. Just... fascinating possiblities.

@Tempest Being the nerd that I am, I have several dozen House Rule tweaks to suggest, but I -believe- that most of them are already integrated into the DoD database--including halving the bonuses to Dark Rage (at +3, +2, or +1 it's not nearly as broken, but it's still great). On the rage issue, I would definitely remove the Dreadful Rage feat from the game. It's not just Wookiees, anything with the rage species trait gets ridiculously awesome in melee. They're good at starting, but the Dreadful Rage feat just superpowers them. I might be able to make that tweak myself (to @Lotherio's point), but I can certainly get you in touch with someone who can make a tweak like that (and who might be able to get you a database without the DoD homebrew stuff in it).

Well, in the Mandalorian Wars, there are no Sith involved (yet). As I recall, there's a year of nothing major happening between the end of the Mando Wars and the beginning of the Jedi Civil War (the time when Revan and Malak are going to Dromund Kaas, getting dominated by the Sith Emperor, finding the Star Forge, breaking the Emperor's hold on them, and building their fleet/armies). So the Mandalorians aren't really a major war faction at the time that the Sith are (although I may have totally misread @Mr-Johnson's intent on when the start the game).

I'm also a pretty huge fan of playing Imperials, but most people want to play the good guys, and I would still strongly suggest starting with just one war faction plus Indies (to keep the playerbase less spread out, and to limit bad OOC feelings based on which side is "winning" the war at any given moment). I mean, it worked well enough on KotOR, and it took a nasty database crash when the database hadn't been backed up in months and significant hardware-based downtime to kill the game, but there was definitely some ugliness involved between people who primarily played Sith and people who primarily played Jedi/Republic.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to bring Darth Trucidas back (ETA: and to play a Taung -Crusader- who dislikes the Neo-Crusaders, and to play a Republic pilot, and... and... and...). And I'm -totally- not trying to claim that my opinions are right and everyone else is wrong. I'm totally just spouting off my opinion.