@Kanye-Qwest I have to second this one; my dearest friend on earth is very much Mr. Viking, and all the co-opting of all things Norse by alt-righters and white supremacists is one of the very few things I have ever seen him get hardcore pissed off about in over a decade.
@RightMeow We are still in the process of cleaning out old stuff, and I still have a mountain of things my husband hasn't taken over to my mother yet so she can donate it to the church. Most right now is some decorative foo, but there's some kitchen things. Nudge if needed, ok?
Depending on how long you can wait, if there's a Target in your area, check their back to school stuff in a month or so. They have had a set of basic plastic dishware for the past few years in their college gear; the colors change each year, but they're actually really nice basics for everyday, and they're very very very reasonable. (Under $1 per piece last year. We got a pile in matte black and use them for our main every day dishes now, super easy care and microwave safe.) They don't LOOK cheap, which is a plus.
This is a small screenshot from CNN.com.
I have so, so many questions. So many. But I won't click the link to find out because I'm sure it won't be funny any more.
Every time I see the hair debate come up, I am so grateful for my best friend in early high school (until she moved 
). We were 14 and it was the 80s and every hair style sucked for everyone which made it super easy to just laugh about together and grouse about our respective hair struggles. I mean, standing in front of the same mirror with so many hair products and devices between us they covered the entire counter and filled the sink, not talking about it would have been so much weirder.
I'm stupidly grateful to have had experiences like that, even back in the 80s stone ages. It's depressing to realize that there's much less of that since, at least in most of the US, because there's so much more social segregation since in some ways, and they're ways that often pretty dramatically reduce the chance for open conversation. 
@Tinuviel said in Diversity Representation in MU*ing:
@Prototart said in Diversity Representation in MU*ing:
there’s also just that white people “dreads” are so universally gross
Dreads and braids aren't the same thing, mind.
...until you sleep on the latter long enough without washing your hair. College roommates can be special. 
It was less a dreadlock and more a dreadlump.
@Wretched I've considered it, if only to be like 'wow, we ran around a lot, huh'. Would not be surprised if results came back 'hot mess'.
@bored We have! Though my mother and her side of things were all in Chicago until she married my father (who is from Delaware; they now live in the house where he grew up). I have heard the alternate form come out of her mouth, though, yeeeeeup. My mothers' folks moved here when I was pretty young -- 8 or 9 I think. She was less grumpy about the Hungarian part, but muuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch less thrilled about the Roma part. I need to ask the maternal one to send what info she had again, since quarantine is as good a time as any to google the ever living shit out of it.
I am a totally ridiculous Euromix. For me, that's enough explanation.
For my relatives? It isn't. Now, I won't pretend it isn't a... uh... unusual cluster of people, such that if I listed out what I know of them to someone who knows me (and the way I live, what I do, etc.), they would both laugh and then nod solemnly with a 'that explains it'.
But it gets ridiculous. "I'm half Italian!" "No, you're a quarter Sicilian and a quarter Italian and the Italian quarter was original Spanish high nobility that fled the Inquisition due to a curiously high number of Jewish names appearing in the history for a bunch of supposed Catholics blah blah blah blah blah... " This is about where I am curious, sure, but know there is a level of ridiculousness going on that is intellectually interesting, but I'm certainly never going to be the baroness (spoiler alert: my great uncle was, and he lived in the neighboring mid-middle class subdivision and was as broke as we are, he was just 'that guy who really, really loves that accordion' to us), and my 2 rooms of the family palazzo <cough wheeze choke snerk mutley-snicker> (read: hot mess with no hot water, a ruin of a top floor, and a lower floor that was sold off for a condo before I was ever born) got sold off a few years ago because we didn't want to fix the desperately shitty collapsed roof or keep paying a full share of the $$$$ taxes on a property where other relatives live 24/7/365 and we have no access to.
And you'd think the stupid was condensed there, but no. My mother's side? We know... 3/4. 1/4 was simply deleted from the otherwise painstakingly curated family history my grandmother spent decades researching and compiling for, in her words, 'being filthy Hungarian gypsies'. One whole half of my grandfather's family was simply not allowed to be known; my mother even only met any of them once, in secret, when my grandfather smuggled her over to meet some cousins one holiday season. I don't even know what group/line it is; we just know that a great aunt doing research recently found more info and 'the oldest record of them is from the 17th century' and some reference to Transylvania. (My mother had to pass this along, insisting 'this is why you LARPed, I'm sure of it' and I winced so fucking hard I blame it for my first wrinkles.) And this bothers me -- not just because of my mother's... uh, yeah, she has the sensitivity of a thrown brick -- but because there's a whole branch of the family I will never know or even ever really know about, because my grandmother was such a bigot. You'd think my grandfather only had one parent, and was budded rather than born or something.
Pretty sure all of my grancestors have at some point been at war with literally all of my other grancestors. It is all supremely absurd, but boy howdy does it explain a lot re: internal conflict, I guess.
I also really want to note: Gany, that is a great example (in both examples you used) of 'calling in' vs. 'calling out', and that difference is not to be overlooked.
It is such a valuable difference.
Someone calling out a stranger on twitter with no data is easy, which is I think why we see so much of it all around on every possible thing. Having a conversation with someone is not so easy, but is usually so much more effective, as it's less likely to get someone instantly on the defensive to the extent that they usually won't listen.
There's definitely a place for calling out. I wish certain world 'leaders' would stop proving that...
@Selira Seconding Wretched on this one. Some forms of stress or crisis can force focus. A lot of ADD/ADHD folks are kickass in a crisis as a result, while everyone else is running around like chickens with their heads cut off.
...if only we weren't, you know, the headless chickens the rest of the time, dammit.
I hit this one hard when my gall bladder went to hell. Literally dying, and I was like 'you are going to wake up and we're going to the hospital now, be ready in 15 minutes'. Everyone else, freaking out. Me? Weirdly calm, cooperating with the things that normally freak me out without a ripple.
Like... I normally flip out any time blood needs to be drawn. They had to do so several times a day for two weeks, until I was very literally so out of veins they were having to go for things in the joint of my upper knuckles with my fingers bent down, and they had to run a picc line which is... really just body horror like whoa to me.
Normal me: "OH GOD I'M GOING TO DIE".
Crisis me: <snapshot of calm stoicism>
Mid-murderypaws:
...and the husband's poster in the background almost makes this relevant:
Bannister flouf.
Dark house is dark today, hence the blurry bad lighting. Ah, well.
@Ganymede That's just it; I knew this at the time (partly why when we went I was surprised as hell to see so many places selling them). This was in the 80s. I chatted with the guy who sold it to us when I mentioned being surprised to see them about the resurgence. The history I knew then was 'feminine empowerment phase initially, became distorted/sexualized as anything like that unfortunately does, became symbol of luxury and dissent with horrific results (as you describe)' and 'remained more prevalent in Hong Kong throughout but was still rare' (which is where we were).
We weren't super comfortable with the idea of buying it at first because of the history (and the sexualization/fetishization), but we could get behind the 'sign of independence', which he explained at the time, along with that it was 'the start of Hong Kong's return to China from the Brits that people wanted to encourage' along the same vein. These did not seem to be bad sentiments, though I can absolutely understand why someone who was not a part of that resurgence would be extremely put off -- it had been our initial take, too. (We kept that guy at the shop chatting until after they would normally have closed, I swear. Maybe he was just trying to sell to the tourists, but that wasn't the impression we got at the time, fwiw.)
I was always the megageek on costuming since I was about 7 or 8, when I realized I was never going to be Jacques Cousteau due to a paralyzing fear of moray eels. (No, really.) I knew this stuff at the time since I did a deep dive on clothing info pre-travel, because megageek, and my mother was a hardcore textile arts hobbyist.
I outgrew it within the year, regardless, but I do keep it.
Even now, when I travel, I try to get something wearable that is traditional in some way to the area. It's mostly jewelry or an accessory these days, since not a lot of places have things in 'one size fits short round woman made of boobs', but it's an interest in the area and related clothing and ornaments. I have a lot of stuff I've bought like this that I could never wear/waggle into, too, since it was an interesting find for whatever reason.
But, yeah, I don't disagree that 'it was pretty' is the most likely reason most people go with -- it's just not everyone's reason. Thirteen year old me would not have ever made it back from that experience if I was in that person's shoes, and the only reason I'm not is because people weren't tweeting in 1986. I doubt anyone would have listened to the info related above, and probably wouldn't (or don't) care either way.
I will totally put up a pic of the kitty in a little bit though 'cause... she's a derpy doll and she's in a nip frenzy today.
@Ganymede I may be in a weird -- ok, no, I know I'm in a weird position on this particular issue, but there's an innate problem, mainly: there's no way to make 'I know the history of this garment/item' as visible as the item itself. Many people won't know, but there are folks who do.
Mine hasn't fit me since 1986, so there's no risk of me running into this issue, but I am rationally inclined to think I'm not a monster with zero cultural sensitivity for wearing it once when I was 13, and seeing that article? Made me feel like I am, today, right now, and nothing will ever change it, just for that. There's a reason I don't visit those boxes in the closet much.
@Ganymede Apologies for mentioning, in that case, and I wouldn't ask you to or expect you to.
@HelloProject Oh, it's not the argument of 'in Asia vs. in the US' that I'm thinking of so much as 'this was the article I read about it'. Like, I'd expect to see crap like that all over FOX news or something for its... "unique" (read: gross) motives, but it's common enough for it to crop up even in the New York Times with people full of contradictory opinions.
I've read a lot on the kimono one, too; there's tons of nuance there also. Like... a lot of the ones that came to the US from the 70s-90s are 'cause they're considered 'used clothing' and it wouldn't be clean or appropriate to wear them, and they were picked up from literal ragpickers from trash, which shocks us, sure, but was societally common then. In a weird way, it's a great example of the symbiotic relationship there -- particularly re: fashion -- because as that became more common, it emphasized the value of them 'at home' and while it means fewer coming here inexpensively these days, that they're valued there as the reason? I am elated as hell by that. Since a lot of the aspects of it are also arts at risk due to the dwindling number of people willing or interested in the long apprenticeships to learn them, the broader interest has helped keep the art form -- and it totally is -- more likely to survive, which I love even if I'd not wear one these days.
A lot of the 'make it from kimono fabric' stuff you see is actually a factor of the way they were brought here (by weight, literally) in that earlier period. A lot of things would be damaged when discarded, or discarded due to minor damage, so sometimes there were only pieces that could be saved. So, again, while I wouldn't necessarily 'go there' myself, I get how that specifically became 'popular' for a while in a very basic way, for a totally nuts and bolts reason vs. any sort of cultural statement. The pieces were apparently absurdly popular to use to make quilts, for instance, that weren't typically anything but 'quilt of pretty squares'.
Three of the ones I have are damaged from this sort of thing; two of the three would have been quite valuable if they were pristine. (One's part of a theater costume similar to a wedding kimono and is covered in embroidery, one is a Maiko kimono that's hand-painted and also heavily embroidered with real gold thread. The former had import stamps slapped onto the silk in the export process <WINCE> and the other was practically falling apart before I repaired it, but it's too fragile to clean.) I'm still glad they're in one piece, all things considered. They're things I would donate now if I didn't love swooning at them every so often; if they were pristine I would do so, but in their current condition they'd unfortunately just be part of the non-display 'research portion' of a costume library, so they can wait until I'm dead for that.
@HelloProject This is a good example re: the furor over clothing. Even the article is full of contradictory opinions, but the attacks if you look at the original link are probably not something most people of any description are likely to want to deal with, ever, to put it mildly.
(FWIW, that's almost identical to a dress I bought in Hong Kong, mine just doesn't have the band of black trim; it's why this sticks out in memory.)
As a fashion and costume and fashion history geek, every single thing about this depresses me. I don't expect you to explain or anything, it's 'if you hadn't seen this, this is an example of what I meant'.
@Wretched It is full of wonderful. Angsty wonderful, but wonderful. And so much is on point for this thread.
@Sunny That general thinking is why I went the way I did. Sometimes, it's instant-other, but others, there's the bonus of 'actually have to deal with this person as an individual'. Also, swing demographic, everybody pitches their team.
