Posts made by Tinuviel

@mietze And here I will list the ingredients...

It was a warm summers day when my golden tresses fell below my lean and narrow shoulders that I came across this particular wonderful vegetable..

Well it looks like we have a fundamentally different view of our roles in the world, so I think we can leave it at that.

@mietze just listen to dubstep. That's basically the jist.

@bored said in TS - Danger zone:

You've mentioned 'I can do this and you can't stop me' stuff including out of band communication.

Uh, no? No, I haven't. I only said that I don't take No-TS policies into account in my decision making. Others brought up other venues, not I.

@bored said in TS - Danger zone:

Plus, again, games with kids. There's no other choice there, right?

We aren't talking about games with kids. I've already made it clear that games with kids don't exist to me in so far as TS is concerned. And arguably, "no ts because kids" isn't a policy it's a law.

I want to poke at some of your wording again, just for a moment. You repeatedly say "cheater" when talking about people that violate this hypothetical policy, and that's inaccurate. Cheaters break the rules to gain an unfair advantage, and that should always be discouraged and punished.

People that violate an innocuous policy, and are then too reticent to comment on abuses suffered because they will be punished are not cheaters.

My argument is, if it's an argument at all, that banning something doesn't eliminate it. It drives it underground where it can become dangerous to its participants. Yes, I agree, people should abide by policy. But even those that don't, without actually cheating (in terms of its actual definition), still deserve to feel safe enough to report it. If it goes unreported, who knows how many people are abused in the same fashion?

And yes, I understand that you don't want to spend your free time wading through the crap brought about by people you don't desire on your game in the first place. But when it comes to harrassment, it's not just a game anymore. MUers, people here in fact, have had their personal details accessed and leaked, in some cases their real lives invaded, due to the actions of abusers and harrassers. I'm glad that you take harrassment seriously, but I think you're seriously underestimating the potential impact of such harrassers and abusers when they know that their victims will be punished just like them if they're reported.

It's not logical, or sensible, to avoid a minor punishment and continue being abused. But people aren't logical or sensible, least of all when they're afraid. A clear TS policy is required, yes. But not a blanket ban. It hurts more than it helps.

@bored said in TS - Danger zone:

I am not sure what you're trying to get across here.

I'm trying to get across the point that I'm not saying what anyone can or can't do. I'm saying it's stupid to try, and that there are inherent dangers with that position.

@bored said in TS - Danger zone:

Lets be clear, first off, with all the really hostile 'you' shit you're throwing around, that I would never ban TS on a game

It's a general 'you', but if you want to assume it's actually directed at you then... fine? You said the words "category of player not worth the energy protecting." Perhaps, just maybe, you want to work on your phrasing. Because that just sounds like you're going to dismiss any claims of harrassment from anyone that's broken a rule.

I'm going to use the 'zero tolerance' anti-bullying bullshit as my example. If both kids are going to get suspended for fighting, no matter what, then they're not going to report they got beaten up. You want them to report getting beaten up, otherwise you can't deal with it. Even if one is a perfectly content and apparently obedient little snot, you want the other kid to feel safe in making that report.

I'm afraid I'm approaching this from a real-world perspective, rather than a MU perspective. And I think anyone falling through the cracks is a goddamn failure, even though it's inevitable. Even a murderer deserves to be treated properly when they claim someone's trying to kill them.

@bored said in TS - Danger zone:

The danger here is only for the niche category of player who is harassed while breaking the rules, yet finds it preferable to tolerate the harassment rather than admit to and face any consequences for their own behavior.

Which ideal world is it that you live on, and where can I get a ticket?

People break rules all of the time. People are harrassed and abused all of the time. How is it so alien an idea that those two things criss-cross far more often than we hear about?

Yes. You can do whatever you want with your game. You can make it about anything, anywhere, any time, and with any rules. I still reserve the privilege (because rights don't exist here) to call you a fuckin' moron.

@bored said in TS - Danger zone:

this seems like a category of player not worth the energy protecting

The idea that a person being abused isn't worth the energy protecting makes you look utterly reprehensible. Who cares that they broke the rules? If you're going to ignore them, or punish them for reporting it to you, you're tacitly silencing people that need help.

@Sunny said in TS - Danger zone:

@Tinuviel said in TS - Danger zone:

@Sunny said in TS - Danger zone:

'because I say so' doesn't explain shit

It doesn't work on children, why would we expect it to work on relatively seasoned adults?

Exactly!

Sometimes, though. Just sometimes. "Because that's just the way it is..." is an acceptable answer. "Why do people break rules? Because they do."

@Sunny said in TS - Danger zone:

'because I say so' doesn't explain shit

It doesn't work on children, why would we expect it to work on relatively seasoned adults?

@Ganymede In the vague example I gave, I'd treat it more like... well, prostitution as it is depicted on television. Yes, you're doing wrong. But this big thing you're reporting is way more important to deal with right now.

ETA: I wouldn't want anyone to feel that they would be punished for reporting a serious incident, under almost any circumstances.

@JinShei Except when it rains. Assuming it's quality tweed.

@DareDaemon said in TS - Danger zone:

@Tinuviel

@Tinuviel said in TS - Danger zone:

@DareDaemon said in TS - Danger zone:

@Tinuviel said in TS - Danger zone:

@DareDaemon said in TS - Danger zone:

@Tinuviel said in TS - Danger zone:

@DareDaemon said in TS - Danger zone:

And, presumably, the game doesn't explicitly prohibit TS. (I've encountered people who wouldn't let such a rule stop them.)

I absolutely don't let such a rule stop me.

If you don't like that a game prohibits TS, don't fucking play there. It's fucking gross to violate such a clear boundary.

Well, yeah. Did you not read the whole post?

You edited it while I was responding.

Yeah, well the page updates when posts are edited.
My overall point is still the same. Anti-TS policies are stupid and will always, always be violated. If I really, really want to do something (TS is not actually on that list, by the by, but it does illustrate my point) people are going to do it. And so long as it remains underground, people that engage in it and then have to deal with negative consequences from that don't have anyone to report it to.

TS is like prostitution in that way. Make whatever law you want about it, it's not going away only being driven underground. You can either be sensible, and treat your adult players as adults (naturally none of this applies if your game is catering to children) that want to and will do adult things, or you can be stupid about it and assume that because it's written down it's going to be obeyed and then make anyone that needs to report something too afraid of punishment from you to report it.

You don't have the right to tell staff that they have to adjudicate textfucking if people have some gripes about what happened during their textfucking. Insisting that as staff that's part of my job, is fucking disgusting.

Everyone has a right to opt out of anything to do with TS, and that includes staff. The only way for staff to opt out of that is to prohibit it.

If you want to take your characters textfucking, feel free to go to one of those places dedicated for textfucking.

Actually I'm insisting that as staff, part of your job is dealing with problems and players engaging in 'problematic' behaviour.

You stated above that your only TS experience has come through pressure. How would you feel if staff then insisted that you were at fault, because you were engaging in bad behaviour?

If you don't want to encounter people being fucking horrid to each other in any number of ways, don't staff. That's how you fucking opt out of that.

And since you don't seem to understand what the fuck the constructive section is about, let me lay something simple down for you with as much acid as I can muster at this hour of the morning.

If you are staffing, you are doing a job. I don't give a flying monkey's ass what your personal feelings are, if you can't handle the idea of someone approaching you as a figure of authority to explain that yes, they were doing something against the rules, and were pressured or coerced or otherwise mistreated into doing something they weren't comfortable with. If you are incapable of setting aside your own prejudices and biases long enough to deal with an abusive player? You're the failure. You're the asshole. And it's your behaviour that's fucking gross.

@Ganymede said in TS - Danger zone:

@Tinuviel said in TS - Danger zone:

Talking with you chucklefucks about while typefucking.

FTFY.

I save that for you these days, lover.

@Ganymede said in TS - Danger zone:

@Tinuviel said in TS - Danger zone:

I'm already in my room, of course. That's where all my stuff is.

The problem is not that he is in his room; it's what he's doing in his room that's the problem.

Talking with you chucklefucks about typefucking.

@Sunny I'm already in my room, of course. That's where all my stuff is.

NSFW-ish Reaction Gif

@Roz Thanks for reminding me that Transformers porn exists.

@DareDaemon said in TS - Danger zone:

@Tinuviel said in TS - Danger zone:

@DareDaemon said in TS - Danger zone:

@Tinuviel said in TS - Danger zone:

@DareDaemon said in TS - Danger zone:

And, presumably, the game doesn't explicitly prohibit TS. (I've encountered people who wouldn't let such a rule stop them.)

I absolutely don't let such a rule stop me.

If you don't like that a game prohibits TS, don't fucking play there. It's fucking gross to violate such a clear boundary.

Well, yeah. Did you not read the whole post?

You edited it while I was responding.

Yeah, well the page updates when posts are edited.
My overall point is still the same. Anti-TS policies are stupid and will always, always be violated. If I really, really want to do something (TS is not actually on that list, by the by, but it does illustrate my point) people are going to do it. And so long as it remains underground, people that engage in it and then have to deal with negative consequences from that don't have anyone to report it to.

TS is like prostitution in that way. Make whatever law you want about it, it's not going away only being driven underground. You can either be sensible, and treat your adult players as adults (naturally none of this applies if your game is catering to children) that want to and will do adult things, or you can be stupid about it and assume that because it's written down it's going to be obeyed and then make anyone that needs to report something too afraid of punishment from you to report it.

@DareDaemon said in TS - Danger zone:

@Tinuviel said in TS - Danger zone:

@DareDaemon said in TS - Danger zone:

And, presumably, the game doesn't explicitly prohibit TS. (I've encountered people who wouldn't let such a rule stop them.)

I absolutely don't let such a rule stop me.

If you don't like that a game prohibits TS, don't fucking play there. It's fucking gross to violate such a clear boundary.

Well, yeah. Did you not read the whole post?

@DareDaemon said in TS - Danger zone:

@Tinuviel

@Tinuviel said in TS - Danger zone:

@Arkandel said in TS - Danger zone:

do you ever feel like TS doesn't fit the game

I don't work with children or animals. So if I'm playing (or playing with) either of those things, then TS is a big big big no. If I'm playing an adult person in any setting designed around its own internal logic (as in a form of 'realism') then TS isn't off the table, so long as I'm reasonably justified in believing all other participants are adults also playing adult persons.

And, presumably, the game doesn't explicitly prohibit TS. (I've encountered people who wouldn't let such a rule stop them.)

I absolutely don't let such a rule stop me.

ETA: Though to be fair, if a game has such a rule and isn't populated by children or child-like PCs, I'm probably not going to play there anyway.

@tek said in The Work Thread:

This is why I will never be taken seriously in academia.

Who the fuck wants to be taken seriously in academia? We'd need way more tweed.