Mass Effect MU*?

Tat

I'm going to glaze over a lot of the engine-specific ideas, because @faraday's got it covered and I wouldn't know what I could add to the conversation except --

-- yeah, damn right! Uh -- yeah.

@tat said in Mass Effect MU*?:

Are you envisioning 'biotic' as the skill and specific attacks/abilities as weapons?

Two questions here. I see "Biotic" as an Action Skill, just like Melee and Firearms. When you talk of specific attacks/abilities, I presume you mean things like "Carnage" and "Marksman." Unfortunately, I don't see a place for those specific powers on the game, but FS3's combat has things like "aim" and taking aggressive combat stances that serve as a substitute. With my custom system, I had those abilities in there, but I'm willing to sacrifice it for the wondrous combat engine.

That said, if there were a way to code it easily? I'm all for it.

Yes, specific skills like 'carnage' and 'marksman', but also like 'overload' and 'nova' and 'throw' and 'cryo blast'. For me, these sorts of wildly fun combat things are a big part of what gets me into ME - and it's some of the most fun I've had playing it. It is a game that allows for so many players to be so snowflakey badass in so many unique ways that really makes storytelling fun (in my opinion).

Many of these specific skills could be handled by creative use of weapons and armor and stances, plus some GMing. Some of them can't be. Interestingly, the gun ones that you mention are probably the easiest - you can use 'specials' on weapons to mimic marksman, which improves aim, and carnage, which I'd say would increase lethality. That's actual super, super simple, and you could do it on a vanilla FS3 v3 install in like 15 minutes.

PS: Some of the stuff @glitch is doing for the game we're working on MIGHT be able to be applied to some of the weird biotic stuff. It's still hacky, and some things probably still won't work, but it's a possibility. He'd know better than I.

I think there's a thin line between simplifying the gameplay and losing a lot of the flavor of what makes ME fun for a lot of people.

I'd like to think that what makes ME fun is one of two things: (1) the fast, FPS action; and (2) the interesting setting. I don't think a MUSH is going to be able to compete with the real game for (1), but it can get a bit deeper for (2) due to its nature.

I mean, I think you're not /wrong/, but I do think you're maybe discounting a little bit of what's involved in 1. Some people play ME like a shooter, but a LOT of people don't. Like, recently an A&O player was reminiscing about that one time she ninja stealthed and dropped from the ceiling to attack a yahg with a sword. THAT is the sort of badass you want to be sure to enable, IMO. Cutting out the special skills or reducing them all to 'biotic' makes that harder.

If I weren't on board building a different game, I'd be all over it. I'm pretty sure people will hit me over the head if I take on two, though.

Depending on the timeline, maybe you could come on board when it's all done. There's a lot to be said about planning, and I'm a planner.

Sure, hit me up. I can at the very least talk a lot about ways to bend FS3 in ways that make Faraday cry.

Ganymede

@tat said in Mass Effect MU*?:

Yes, specific skills like 'carnage' and 'marksman', but also like 'overload' and 'nova' and 'throw' and 'cryo blast'. For me, these sorts of wildly fun combat things are a big part of what gets me into ME - and it's some of the most fun I've had playing it. It is a game that allows for so many players to be so snowflakey badass in so many unique ways that really makes storytelling fun (in my opinion).

I get that. The homebrew system I made allowed you to do some fun ability-combos, like shifting where others acted in initiative, and so on. It was built from a combination of Blood Bowl, WH40K, and Pokémon. Don't ask me how I came up with that combo.

But FS3's combat engine seems to be a simultaneous-action-resolver, right? It doesn't lend to sequential events well.

That said, I mean, there's time. And planning. A sit-down and chat regarding what can be changed in the combat system would probably go a long way. It's probably of no surprise that I always pick a Soldier concept, and generally can't be bothered to play with Tech or Biotic characters.

faraday

@ganymede said in Mass Effect MU*?:

But FS3's combat engine seems to be a simultaneous-action-resolver, right? It doesn't lend to sequential events well.

No, there's initiative. The only thing is that KO's don't happen till the end, so nobody's action gets cut off. Of course if their damage mods get up to -10 from all the hits they took before their action, it's a hail mary but at least they get their dying gasp

Tat

@faraday said in Mass Effect MU*?:

@ganymede said in Mass Effect MU*?:

But FS3's combat engine seems to be a simultaneous-action-resolver, right? It doesn't lend to sequential events well.

No, there's initiative. The only thing is that KO's don't happen till the end, so nobody's action gets cut off. Of course if their damage mods get up to -10 from all the hits they took before their action, it's a hail mary but at least they get their dying gasp

And you can add initiative mods to weapons, if that's ever relevant to something you're trying to do. In terms of ME, I'd definitely think of 'weapons' not only as guns and ninja swords, but also tech and biotic things as far as possible. So if a biotic ability should take precedent (say, someone doing a biotic charge at superspeed), you could crank their init up to reflect that.

There really is a LOT of flexibility in the system once you dig into all the custom stuff you can change. The new thing where you can add specials to weapons adds a ton of options, too.

SG

I kind of want to do an XCOM mush today. I hope Ares drops soon.

Tat

@sg

Done right, that would be an amazing MU.

SG

@tat Have no fear, I will do it all sorts of wrong.

Tez

@sg said in Mass Effect MU*?:

I kind of want to do an XCOM mush today. I hope Ares drops soon.

I hope you'll have policies to account for meatgrinder levels of character turnover and death.

Godot

@ganymede That sounds fantastic.

There are people allergic to coded systems directly affecting the environment, but I am not one of them.

I'll echo what @Roz said, in different words - the Mass Effect experience is a power fantasy. The form it takes varies, but it tends towards flashy, extreme competence.

I played on Alpha & Omega briefly, and taking the Multiplayer archetypes as the template for PCs was brilliant. It reduced complexity. It meant having three or four Special Tangible Things that mattered in fights, but they could also be touchstones for your character's history and personality.

It ended up being more than just combat moves. It became like 13th Age's Backgrounds-as-skills and a character's One Unique Thing combined. It seemed so to me, at least.

I suggest that working out an arsenal of "powers" within the FS3 framework and giving PCs freedom to choose 3 would grant instant familiarity to players and yield benefits of wider importance than adding combat options would appear to do, especially if they're emphasized within a character sheet as defining elements.

I recognize that would add considerable work, even if many powers could end up being flavors of the same FS3 effect, but I thought I'd put a bee in your bonnet about their usefulness for characterization and inspiration.

SG

@tez said in Mass Effect MU*?:

@sg said in Mass Effect MU*?:

I kind of want to do an XCOM mush today. I hope Ares drops soon.

I hope you'll have policies to account for meatgrinder levels of character turnover and death.

The only way to survive a mission will be to have hawt ts with admin.

Also, my admin name will be RNG.

Three-Eyed Crow

@sg
If run as a TGG-style meat-grinder (both emphasis on soft RP outside of combat and ruthless enforcement of 'KO with no luck points is death' in combat? I would play the fuck out of that. And I think it's as perfectly suited for FS3 as a setting can be, really.

Crawfish

Oh my friggin' god be still my heart please oh please oh please don't tease me I want this so bad.

ixokai

@ganymede said in Mass Effect MU*?:

Races: Asari, Humans, Krogans, Quarians, Salaria]ns, and Turians. Oh my!

No Drell? You are dead to me.

Ganymede

@ixokai said in Mass Effect MU*?:

No Drell? You are dead to me.

Old homebrew system. It has been stricken. Most non-Council races probably wouldn't have a place, and Drell are really tied to the Hanar.

But, we'll see, I guess.

Thenomain

@ganymede

You don't need PC Hanar to have Drell, tho. Mind you, there are a bunch of non-Council races so I don't blame you.

Roz

@ganymede said in Mass Effect MU*?:

@ixokai said in Mass Effect MU*?:

No Drell? You are dead to me.

Old homebrew system. It has been stricken. Most non-Council races probably wouldn't have a place, and Drell are really tied to the Hanar.

But, we'll see, I guess.

Omg. First you don't want biotic and tech powers, now you don't want non-Council races? You are KILLING ME, GANYMEDE.

Ganymede

@roz

I didn't say I didn't want powers! I said that they'd be tricky to code, and may need to be waived or ignored.

I just -- no, no Hanar, plz.

Drell, I'm okay with, but I'm pretty sure that, in canon, they are sort of rare. Then again, on a game where your race may not mean a lot system-wise, whatever, right?

saosmash

@ganymede honestly in multiple years of running a game in the universe most people played humans. My main alt was a quarian and the other one was a turian but I mean normal people.

Ganymede

Okay. None of the following:

Hanar
Elcor
Volus
Asari

Just kidding on the last! Where would we be without hot blue aliens?

Sparks

@ganymede said in Mass Effect MU*?:

Okay. None of the following:

Elcor

Resigned question: Does this mean no performance of Hamlet.