Health and Wealth and GrownUp Stuff

Auspice

@Derp Being able to gain muscle mass really easily, but struggling to lose fat (thanks thyroid condition and PCOS!) is a large part of my issue, too. The instant I start working out: boom, muscle mass. But then the other conditions make the fat take forever (if at all) to fall off.

Arkandel

Losing fat, barring medical conditions, is very similar to balancing a budget; you find out your TDEE (basically your caloric balance) and then eat under that. Free (or very cheap) apps like MyFitnessPal help track and accomplish the latter.

That's it. If you exercise while you're at it you'll also lose relatively little muscle while you're eating at a deficit, which accelerates the fat loss. Either way it'll go away - although a lot of things factor into it, such as the way each individual body uses up calories (i.e. how large a portion of the energy deficit it taps into its fat reserves to replenish).

There are many good, free resources out there to help. I recommend the LoseIt subreddit and the associated FAQ.

Derp

@Arkandel said in Health and Wealth and GrownUp Stuff:

Losing fat, barring medical conditions, is very similar to balancing a budget; you find out your TDEE (basically your caloric balance) and then eat under that. Free (or very cheap) apps like MyFitnessPal help track and accomplish the latter.
That's it. If you exercise while you're at it you'll also lose relatively little muscle while you're eating at a deficit, which accelerates the fat loss.

No. It's really, really not. And that's exactly the kind of received wisdom that most of us have to contend with.

For the average person, that might work, but for many of us, it doesn't. At all. Caloric deficits result in a loss of muscle mass before fat mass even when training regularly, and there are conditions like @Auspice's where this wisdom doesn't work.

So thanks, but I've been living with this and researching it for the better part of two decades, and that doesn't actually work for everyone.

Arkandel

@Derp said in Health and Wealth and GrownUp Stuff:

@Arkandel said in Health and Wealth and GrownUp Stuff:

Losing fat, barring medical conditions, is very similar to balancing a budget

Emphasis mine.

Sunny

@Arkandel

Well, I mean, you walked into a conversation where people with medical conditions were discussing how they had difficulty specifically losing fat, and dropped that pearl of "wisdom" on their heads, I'm not sure what kind of reaction you were expecting.

ETA: True? Yup. Makes it look like you didn't actually read the conversation before adding your input? Also yup. Did you know that going for a walk outside helps with depression?

ETA2: 'It worked for me so if it doesn't work for you you're just <lazy>!' needs to die in a fucking fire already.

Auspice

One of my issues comes from a birth defect. I go through periods of time in which most foods make me very sick (and can last anywhere from days to weeks). When those happen, all I can do is eat whatever I can manage. If that's just (grilled) chicken sandwiches and mashed potatoes? Welp. A gal's gotta eat.

Rinel

Yeah, it's universally accurate that eating at a caloric deficit will make you lose weight. What, precisely, is lost--that's a wholly separate issue.

I've been doing intermittent fasting, which apparently has some benefits re: glycogen depletion yada yada yada, but honestly the best part of it for me is just that I have fewer periods of time in which to stuff my face. I am a terrible late-night snacker. Turning that off is very helpful.

surreality

@Sunny Of all the posts on this forum I have wanted to upvote 300 times, this one wins out over all of them. ALL OF THEM.

It's not even the calories. What is going in makes a huge difference. Me? Seltzer and a few saltines a day, I will gain weight. Eat a half pound of bacon a day for a week with other high fat no-carb things? I will drop weight like I'm literally pissing it off. (SERIOUSLY body, what the fuck is with that?! There are worse things that could work, sure, but that's expensive as fuck. I clearly have the strict carnivore flaw, which blows for someone who loves a good artisan whole grain bread or sourdough. :|)

mietze

@Arkandel I think what people are trying to get at is that, just in case you've never been fat or struggled with significant or stubborn weight loss or haven't experienced losing weight and then regaining or other things like that, those comments really aren't anything that they've not heard before, usually spoken in a very condescending or dismissive way.

As I have had to say to doctors and other people in my life during times where I am heavy (I've been all over the place as an adult), "I'm FAT not STUPID thanks."

And as others have said, and doctors who specialize in the treatment of obesity can tell you, it's actually NOT that simple. So unless you want to hurt the person, I really honestly would advise not telling anyone that. It's okay. Someone else has already told them, trust me.

Auspice

@mietze said in Health and Wealth and GrownUp Stuff:

@Arkandel I think what people are trying to get at is that, just in case you've never been fat or struggled with significant or stubborn weight loss or haven't experienced losing weight and then regaining or other things like that, those comments really aren't anything that they've not heard before, usually spoken in a very condescending or dismissive way.

As I have had to say to doctors and other people in my life during times where I am heavy (I've been all over the place as an adult), "I'm FAT not STUPID thanks."

And as others have said, and doctors who specialize in the treatment of obesity can tell you, it's actually NOT that simple. So unless you want to hurt the person, I really honestly would advise not telling anyone that. It's okay. Someone else has already told them, trust me.

This. So much of it.

I've been told 'just count calories!' so many times.

You know what I've found?

I usually don't meet the 'amount to lose weight' calories in a day. I just looked up a calorie calculator. OK. Amount to eat per day to lose weight: 1924.
Amount of calories I've eaten today: 1534.

And weekends are pretty high intake for me since I'm sitting around the house with the free time to cook. Most days would prob be closer to just 1000.

But I've gained weight over the past year. I haven't lost it.

Calorie counting, in my world, is a fucking laughable concept.

Sunny

It's a shitty thing to say said by well-meaning people who are genuinely intending to help. It's not usually said from a place that desires to be hurtful, which is why I'm sure that when he gets back to the computer and reads all of this he's going to feel not great. Message delivered loud and clear, I'm pretty sure.

Snackness

My issue, as the OP, is not that I don’t know how to lose weight. I do. I am doing the things. And it’s not that I can’t lose weight. I can.

It’s that my grandfather is an asshole and made me sad this weekend by fat-shaming me and even though I know he’s an asshole and I was halfway expecting it, it still sucked.

eta: However, the Muppet Christmas Carol cures many ills.

Arkandel

@mietze I've been obese - for my entire childhood and much of my adult life. I know how it feels.

I did not mean to dismiss anyone. I apologize. Counting macros worked very well for me, and it has for others. But I should not offer unsolicited advice, so I shut up when prompted to do so.

Macha

I am currently on a steroid as part of my management plan for my pain. I can eat WAY under my calories for a day, and I still GAIN weight, even with doing more physical movement. It's so frustrating, but knowing I am not alone in weight loss/gain hell helps. Thanks, guys.

Now if someone has some advice on helping a bruised rib, I'm all ears.

Auspice

@Macha said in Health and Wealth and GrownUp Stuff:

Now if someone has some advice on helping a bruised rib, I'm all ears.

lie on the opposite side, try not to cry.
... ok it's not helpful but that's all I've got

mietze

I am not sure if it will help for bruising, but I got a rib brace OTC at the drugstore when I had a rib fracture and it was very helpful to get through the day.

Ganymede

@surreality

I found that the keto way worked easiest for me. Pissing off the water weight was great.

More recently, I hit fasting mode due to my work and moving schedule. With no time to eat, I just didn’t. One meal a day for two weeks, and another inch came off the waist.

None of the above is particularly easy, like quitting smoking. In the end, I figure that if you’re happy with the way you look, cool.

Me, I’m never happy with my appearance. Which is probably why I’m so fucking angry all the time and torture myself for shits and giggles. Right now, I’m trying to get back into keto while also teaching myself how to bake.

surreality

@Ganymede I'm going to be looking into that after the holidays. The old traditional Atkins worked wonders -- it's just SO expensive.

That's one of the sad bits; even good quality carbs are fairly cheap compared to even average quality meat and fresh veggies. This is a pretty significant factor for us at the moment.

Auspice

@Ganymede said in Health and Wealth and GrownUp Stuff:

while also teaching myself how to bake.

There is a saying:
baking is a science, cooking is an art.
This is 100% true.

Precise measurements are required in baking. When you are learning, use recipes. Love recipes. Worship at the altar of recipes. Do not begin altering them or guessing at them or shrugging and going 'whatever' until you are comfortable. A couple years ago, the first recipe I ever went off the rails and made up was the orange madeira cake with orange rum glaze. And even then, I referenced a madeira cake recipe to ensure I got volumes and baking temperatures and times accurate.

Cooking you just sort of throw things together, make sure it tastes right, and that your meat is cooked through.

In baking, mise en place is even more vital because you don't wanna be halfway through and find out you're missing something. Because your recipe can and will often be ruined... as a beginner.

I recommend finding a few YT channels or websites or even books (for bread, I recommend Richard Bertinet: he's my god) that you love and working your way through them.

Wretched

@Auspice Aka, A list of reasons Wretched doesn't bake, but loves to cook. If only I had someone to clean up after me.