7th Sea with Ares?
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...opinion and coding support on a game idea.
Okay. One of the versatilities of Ares that I just realized is the ability to simulate large amounts of area away from a centralized 'hub'. As in, it facilitates a game where you can have groups separated on quests/adventures far away from each other and the central 'hub' area. You don't have to include rooms for every town, territory, island, or ocean location.
So, with this in mind...by brain is pitching the idea of using Ares for a 7th Sea game.
Ideally, the game would keep the newer 2nd Edition dice system, rather than the 1e Roll + Keep.
Eventually...
In addition to a core Admin Staff, there would be Storytellers to run events, and a Staffer for each Nation and Society to coordinate the Metaplot & Events involving each.
In addition to being solo, players would be free to create their own groups & crews, taking part in story arcs like the Castillian Reconquista, The Montagne Rebellion, and the Avalon/Sidhe split.
No need for a massive grid.
Want to hunt Montaigne shipping? Go for it.
Want to start up a Vendel trading company? Cool.
Want to do Syrenth dungeon delving all over Thea? Perfect.
Any interest or opinions?
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Also, now that I think about it...It could just be a straight FS3 port, since the new edition is based on 'raises' of 10 instead of the Roll & Keep system. Change the names of attributes and skills to match the game, directly translate FS3 successes to Raises one-for-one...
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I would very much dig a 7th Sea game. I code up basic systems in Ares for fun and this has always been on my list. By basic I mean in-game c-gen with a sheet that can be viewed on the web. No significant web portal a integration.
I also think an FS3 port could work well too. Someone coded up a plugin using the Pendragon morality system. I've been tempted to explore how that could work in a Game of Thrones style setting using FS3. I bet it could work/enhance a 7th Sea setting as well. But that's just my opinion.
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I'd be down for this...
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@Runescryer said in 7th Sea with Ares?:
Also, now that I think about it...It could just be a straight FS3 port, since the new edition is based on 'raises' of 10 instead of the Roll & Keep system. Change the names of attributes and skills to match the game, directly translate FS3 successes to Raises one-for-one...
The problem is that the "feel" of the game won't be the same because raises and successes aren't statistically comparable. Certain abilities might become overpowered, while others wouldn't work effectively.
You could certainly do swashbuckling in the 7th sea world with FS3 rules. That's similar to what The 8th Sea MUSH did, though they had the advantage of not trying to mimic 7th Sea's specific magic system. But trying to hybrid 7th Sea's rules using FS3 dice just isn't a recipe for success.
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@faraday said in 7th Sea with Ares?:
@Runescryer said in 7th Sea with Ares?:
Also, now that I think about it...It could just be a straight FS3 port, since the new edition is based on 'raises' of 10 instead of the Roll & Keep system. Change the names of attributes and skills to match the game, directly translate FS3 successes to Raises one-for-one...
The problem is that the "feel" of the game won't be the same because raises and successes aren't statistically comparable. Certain abilities might become overpowered, while others wouldn't work effectively.
You could certainly do swashbuckling in the 7th sea world with FS3 rules. That's similar to what The 8th Sea MUSH did, though they had the advantage of not trying to mimic 7th Sea's specific magic system. But trying to hybrid 7th Sea's rules using FS3 dice just isn't a recipe for success.
The 2e game mechanics are dramatically different from the 1e Roll & Keep. The new system is roll Attribute + Skill, but then arrange the dice in groups that add up to 10 or more. Each group is a 'Raise'. So, if you roll 7 dice and get (8,6,6,2,2,8,4). that would be 3 Raises (8+2, 8+2, 6+4; 6 left over). You then spend Raises to complete objective or avoid hazards in a round.
Stock Example: Your character is in a dining room, with a large table in the middle, overhung by a chandelier held up by a rope tied to a hook nearby. The rugs and hanging tapestries are engulfed in flame. There is a small desk near the door in the back, with several papers on it that are beginning to smolder. You need a raise to get across the room, two raises to avoid any damage from the flames (2 wounds total, 1 per raise), and one raise if you want to grab the papers on the way out the door. With the example roll of 3 Raises, you could either escape all damage but loose the papers, or escape with the papers but take 1 damage.
Basically, you're going to average 1 Raise for every 2 dice in the pool. I believe that FS3 averages out to 1 Hit/Success for every 2 points, as well? Or am I completely off on the mechanics?
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@Runescryer said in 7th Sea with Ares?:
Basically, you're going to average 1 Raise for every 2 dice in the pool. I believe that FS3 averages out to 1 Hit/Success for every 2 points, as well?
No, it does not. The number, type, and distribution of successes are all different in FS3 vs. 7Sea. The way FS3 does difficulty modifiers is vastly different. And 7Sea 2e also has other important mechanics like the various bonuses you get at different ranks (like exploding dice at rank 5) that dramatically affect the dice statistics.
It's apples and bananas, really. Unless you want a weird fruit salad of a skill system, you shouldn't try to combine them.
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You could do a comparison between the two sets of dice pools, and see how different they are.
anydice.com can do it.
To see a difference, you do can compare lots of things, like 5 dice to 5 dice, or max pool to max pool, whatever. Once you know what you want to compare, you do pool1 - pool 2, and you'll see the differences.
I have a waggish sense of humor.
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@faraday said in 7th Sea with Ares?:
Unless you want a weird fruit salad of a skill system, you shouldn't try to combine them.
Please do not judge my tastes.
But I concur. I'd go with FS3 or 7th Sea. I'd lean towards FS3 because it is better suited for large-scale combat.
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@Misadventure said in 7th Sea with Ares?:
You could do a comparison between the two sets of dice pools, and see how different they are.
Except it's not just about the raw dice pools. There are so many other factors that come into play when comparing two systems.
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It's been a while since I've read the 7th 2nd Edition rules, and I've never really immersed myself in FS3. I've poked at it before, mostly to see how well it would work for a Game of Thrones game, but that's about it. So what I'm about to say may not be 100% accurate.
I think there are 3 potential ways you could make a 7th Sea game work with Ares. Each comes with some advantages and drawbacks.
- The first way assumes you can separate FS3 Action from FS3 Combat. I'm assuming you can since they're two separate plugins but I've never tried it. Assuming you can, you could use FS3 Action to simulate a makeshift version of 7th Sea.
- This would allow you to use a makeshift version of the 7th Sea action economy.
- This would give you complete web integration for character generation.
- Some players might find it weird to use FS3 Action and not Combat.
- This will not be anything close to a perfect conversion. You would need to count actions by successes(which may give you a lot of actions) or success levels, which would limit you to potentially 4(Success, Good, Great, Amazing). Since this is now narrative, you might be able to build on that with advantages.
- Players would need to manage combats independently, using the dice as a guide for their RP.
- Using FS3 Action and Combat to create a 7th Sea inspired game.
- Full web integration for c-gen and combat.
- Players are familiar with this combo.
- You'd have to abandon any pretense of simulating the 7th Sea action economy. FS3 Combat just doesn't work that way.
- You might be able to simulate low-level magic so long as it is limited to narrative aspects and simulating weapons and armor in combat. Meaning nothing that FS3 can't already do. No deflection spells or anything like that.
- Not use any version of FS3 and use the 7th Sea system as it is.
- You can play 7th Sea as it was meant to be played.
- Minimal web integration(a sheet on a character profile and basic dice).
- Players would have to manage everything independently combat-wise.
I guess option 2 would be the best way to go for my money. If only because it'd be the easiest to set up and support. You'd lose the action economy, but you might have difficulty selling that to players anyway. I know I've encountered push back on it when I've tried to get it up and running in my tabletop games.
Just my thoughts on the matter.
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FS3Skills is a separate plugin from FS3Combat. Many games have used the skills system without automated combat. I continue to advise against option #1 because the game will not be properly balanced as previously discussed.
The RPG plugin lets you basically use raw dice and a text/PDF sheet to manually use any TTRPG, so that's an option.
Or, of course, find someone to code the real 7th Sea system in Ares.
