@ziggurat said in Social Stats in the World of Darkness:
@Ganymede, I saw your comment about being able to manipulate and outwit other players, on an OOC level, and typically leaning towards manipulative character archetypes for that reason.
If I gave you that impression, I may have mis-typed.
I really don't lean towards manipulative character archetypes. (I tend to lean more towards broken people who have violent tendencies; please see Shrike.) What I know, however, is that I'm fairly good at manipulation, planning, and writing convincingly. Some people say it is part of my charm. As such, I feel compelled to put points into my social stats, so that I'm not cheating if my PC suddenly tries and succeeds in tricking someone else to do what they want. In other words, I make sure that my PCs have some social clout because I know that I sometimes fall in that direction.
I definitely agree with the sentiment that removing rules in a way that makes social manipulation/conflict hinge itself entirely upon the abilities of PLAYERS and not about their characters, is bad for a lot of reasons.
I have concluded that whether there are social stats or not is irrelevant; social manipulation and conflict, without a strict, robust system, is always going to hinge upon a player's ability to communicate in writing. Period. It is neither a good nor a bad thing; it simply is this way. If a player wants to alter their PC's communicative skills, that is literally entirely up to them, if they are a skilled writer.
It means that players can really only play as characters with their level of social aptitude or less, with their talent for writing also applying, essentially, the lesser of their abilities as a socialite or writer determines how socially capable their characters can be.
I don't mean to be blunt or mean, but this is simply the case and I think it has to do with our medium; however, it is less about one's social aptitude and more about one's ability to communicate in the written medium. And it is not a limit on your characters' potential; it is a limit on how your characters will be perceived.
If you are unable to pull together a cogent sentence, constantly misspell words, or use confusing or improper syntax, many players are not going to consider your character persuasive, manipulative, or charming. If you roll to try to make the other players treat your character differently, I think you will find that quite a few people are simply going to avoid your PC. It's not a personal thing, necessarily; it could simply be that the other player wants to spend their online RP time with other players that type as well as they think they do.
I have seen countless times players electing to avoid other players because of their perceived inability to communicate well. No amount of social stats is going to change this. If that's the case, then why bother with social stats at all? People judge as they will judge.
… and those that lack social skills or even struggle with social interaction because of things beyond their control (maybe they struggle with a mental illness, or perhaps are on the autism spectrum, etc) are at a pretty steep disadvantage, and will struggle to have fun.
Anecdotally, I think this is the case already. And, unfortunately, I don't think any amount of system tweaking is going to change this. It's a social issue in our hobby.