The Pack Discussion
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@Cobalt I would like to point out, I said you may be acting off edited logs, and bad intel. I tried to give the benefit of the doubt, on that.
Because, as always - as often as it burns me and gets me hurt, I want to believe in the good in people.
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@Macha I wasn't going to do this publicly, but you can't leave well enough alone.
You don't respect boundaries . Repeatedly coming onto my game via VPN after being sitebanned in order to send my players unwanted and unsolicited messages about your drama is seriously fucked up.
You need to step away and take care of your shit.
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@Macha Question.
When the SA accusation/ban was handed down, were you able to explain your side of things?
The reason I ask, is because from what I've read here and the logs, if you had no intention of hurting anyone or triggering anyone, it feels reasonable to be able to say "hey, this wasn't my intention, etc" and work towards some kind of resolution. We've seen some pretty heinous shit in logs and what was in this logs didn't seem agregious, at least from a "forcing self on someone" context.
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@Ghost Nope. Cobalt never said anything to me at all.
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@Bessarion A - I didn't know I was banned, for one, especially after the 'leave drama where it came from' forum post. Yes, I checked to see if I was banned on the forum posts. I would never have logged in, if there had been mention.
B- work laptop, also has an auto-login to the VPN on start up. Don't worry, I have zero intentions of coming back.
I would have told you in Private Message, but you told me not to reply, so I didn't.
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@Hella I am sure it must be painful to think about and share, and I appreciate the empathy. I long ago gave up on a large chunk of those people ever giving me a fair shot. (Hence why I would never, ever, try to play on Arx)
The thing that does bother me, is I want to believe Cobalt was acting out of good intent, to bad intel. But she's also apparently gotten me banned from places? Places I never played on, apped at, etc?
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@Cobalt Let me explain, here. You're not being attacked and I'm deeply sorry for why things were triggering for you in the log. Your past experiences are your business and you do not need to justify whether or not they are valid.
However, this incident was described as "extremely traumatic" and as an "attempt to rape/seduce a character who is under the influence of drugs". I read that you didn't want to name names, but specifically named @Macha 's character and omitted the name of Isaac's bit. I also read that you said that there were "other creepers", that OOC drama was involved in the situation, and it was enough to close the game altogether.
That's a lot to wrangle.
So as someone who is trying to understand the full scope of things, I have the following questions (and you're in a place that won't personally attack you, which is a bonus):
- Were any of your PCs intimately/romantically involved with the Isaac bit and were you and @Macha both potential victims of a harem building situation?
- What is your reason for not questioning the accused to get their side of things? Options for course correction, etc
- Were you aware that MacKenzie was helmed by @Macha and why did you name them specifically in your account of things despite there being multiple alleged creepers on the game?
Because from what's been said, @Macha did not intend for their RP to come across as rapey in any manner, has posted their side of things, and sounds like they would like to reach an amicable solution. It does not sound like they intended to (or are callous to) any triggers that were tripped. There seems to be an opportunity here to learn something and move forward without people being attacked.
But to be 100pct transparent...if you had characters ICly romantically involved with this Isaac bit, I am going to ask why @Macha was specifically called out in a situation in which you had a personal stake in (and why this was never disclosed), and am going to ask whether or not you were upset when you learned that the Mackenzie and Isaac bit were RPing intimate things privately.
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Y'all should rename this thread to "a handful of exceptionally problematic people cluelessly demonstrate why they are pariahs". No one is buying the whiplash-inducing spin you're selling. Please leave this thread up forever it is a perfect demonstration of why this board is dead.
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@Ghost In response to triggers -THIS IS A WARNING - SA Triggers - this has been very hard for me. Because when I was young and stupid, I was at my then boyfriend's house, for a party. He got me to take hits from his.. apparatus. I was not (Still am not) a regular partaker in THC.
I was given some shots, it was a party. He asked someone else to take me home. Yes. He assaulted me, because I had become completely out of sorts. I will not go into further details. No one needs to know that shit. So yeah. I would never, ever, RP that sort of thing out.
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@simplications said in The Pack Discussion:
Y'all should rename this thread to "a handful of
exceptionallyawesomelyproblematichumanpeoplemeat popsicles cluelesslydemonstrateimprovving why they arepariahsconsidering going to Subway for lunch but are also considering one of those make-your-own-pizza places idk."Fixed it for ya. Good on you for having villains to provide conflict for you in a terribly mundane and virus-ridden world.
Give me a VPN and two weeks, and half of everyone who hates me will think I'm their new best friend depending on whose ass I kiss and who I dogpile on. Scene is flimsy and predictable af.
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Didn’t you just disavow us with a dramatic exit not even a page ago? Is this one of those “I wish I knew how to quit you” situations? Get in or get out but don’t stand there yelling through the screen door.
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@Macha You repeatedly came to my game as a guest for the sole purpose of paging my players about your nonsense. That's why you were banned. You're not as clever as you think you are.
Just.
Stop.
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@Derp said in The Pack Discussion:
Didn’t you just disavow us with a dramatic exit not even a page ago? Is this one of those “I wish I knew how to quit you” situations? Get in or get out but don’t stand there yelling through the screen door.
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Sometimes when I don't want a conversation to exist, I interrupt it with off-topic accusations and pictures of food to make it stop.
@Cobalt Sorry if it got buried but I'd love to hear your side of things, have those questions answered, and if in the end if Macha was clearly in the wrong I promise you I will hold them accountable for it (alas, without attacking them for anyone's enjoyment, but you get the point).
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@Bessarion I came, and paged a single person, to apologize for not being able to carry out agreed upon plots, finish out conversations being had OOCly etc. I did not get a response before today.
All were from the work laptop, as mine was recently 'fixed' only to realize it needs more fixing.
Not trying to be 'clever'. I stated that I did not know previously of a ban, and said I would not be back. That's it. No intention of darkening your virtual doorstep again.
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@Macha This is a lie, unless you're going to claim that the page logs that were reported were doctored, too.
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@Bessarion To the best of my recollection, I paged one person post Pack ban (and the then ban from 6, I would gather?) , and attempted to explain what happened and apologize. The person had given me their character's name on 6ix, upon word the Pack was closing. I made some light hearted chat commentary, yes, because I always think it's a bit odd when a guest does not respond to a warm welcome.
But there was one person I paged to talk to, and apologize, etc. They told me they believed Cobalt, I pointed out I still held out the chance Cobalt was reacting to edited logs(That is truly what I want to believe, in fact, because apparently you can edit Ares logs easier than I thought. No one could blame her, if things were edited). I said I had wanted to say sorry, I had, and wished them a good Pi day. I left.
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Whether or not you think a person is annoying does not by proxy make them a sexual assaulter. Take it off line.
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Remember that scene from Underworld where Viktor was this dry, dusty, dessicated pile of twigs under the floor, but then Selene fed him her blood and alla sudden there was this animation of veins filling, cobwebs disappearing, and he was brought back to being an evil, juice-filled and no longer dry, dusty villain fuckhead intent on killing whoever didn't follow his commands? No one wants to be a tired, bored, dusty, cobwebby vampire. Anyway, I just randomly thought about that (totally unrelated), but I think it's great how much a debate about whether or not it's okay to bully or accuse someone brings out so much energy in people.
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I don't see sexual assault in those logs either but I get how the pretense could be triggering to someone exposed to this exact sort of real life trauma. Macha, you said you have your own trauma regarding this kind of situation, but not every person reacts the same way psychologically about these things. Maybe skirting the boundaries of these questionable acts in roleplay is cathartic to you while it might be incredibly repulsive to others.
That said, it doesn't seem to me like a very damning thing, objectively, to add to your apparent list of weird offenses. However, just like @Hella wrote, people will seldom trot back their understanding of a situation even when confirmation of your perspective comes to light.
If there was something to be learned from this, I think it's probably not to roleplay questionably-icky things with a person whose enthusiastic consent you do not have in any sort of record. It does seem odd that Cobalt didn't talk to you about the situation at all, but the immediate jump to suspect that their motivations were jealous is also odd to me. Hopefully they will comment and clear this up.
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@hobos If Cobalt had spoken to me, I could have pulled up the pages from the time of the scene, where he and I had checked with each other multiple times to make sure everything was cool with the other, and offering to edit things if the other wanted, etc. Everything in that scene was discussed/consensual.
That scene was not at all cathartic to me, btw. Years of therapy are the only reason I can even confess publicly it happened without getting panicked or crying.
