+
is non-optional.
The 's' on +jobs
is non-optional.
This is a UX complaint in the wrong thread, but it's always bugged me about the existing jobs systems.
+
is non-optional.
The 's' on +jobs
is non-optional.
This is a UX complaint in the wrong thread, but it's always bugged me about the existing jobs systems.
Now, for a question I inferred from @Lithium and @Coin: Why not just make each type of XP spend its own kind?
Behold the issue:
> bank arcane=3
Banking 3 Arcane XP
> spend gnosis=4
I want to spend your Mana, which is a spendable stat! What are you doing trying to spend Gnosis!
I would love to contextualize without the need for a prefix, but since this is all about the xp system, if I can keep it all within the 'xp/<switch>' family, I think it would be easier to learn and use.
Mind you, 'xp' has some 6 switches already. I hope this doesn't make it worse.
@Derp said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
In this example, though, how would you mix xp types for those that wish to allow such things?
'xp/bank' is taking a flavor/type of XP to load into the spend-cannon. 'xp/spend' is firing that cannon for a particular trait/stat.
Breaking it down a bit:
> xp/bank <xp type>=<amt to bank>
> xp/spend <stat to buy>=<value to set it to>
"Arcane" is an XP Type. In WoD, there is nearly one per splat. Cover, Arcane, and Vitriol (for Promethean; don't get excited that there is a game about Internet Trolls) are three typical types.
"Strength" and "Gnosis" are stats that are being raised.
Sorry about the confusion, there.
--
edit: I realized just now that I may be confused about the question and can answer it a second way.
In this example, though, how would you mix xp types for those that wish to allow such things?
Let's say that there are three types of XP. Let's call them "Normal", "Arcane", and "Awesome".
So let's say you really want that super-power Gnosis raise, but you don't have enough XP for it unless you spend some Awesome for it. Gnosis costs 5 XP.
> +xp/bank Arcane=2
You have banked 2 Arcane XP for your next spend.
> +xp/bank Awesome=1
You have banked 1 Awesome XP and 2 Arcane XP for your next spend.
> +xp/cost Gnosis=4
Raising Gnosis from 3 to 4 would cost 5 XP: 1 Awesome XP (banked), 2 Arcane XP (banked), and 2 XP.
Pausing here for a moment, notice that the system filled in the missing part with 'Normal XP'. This is because this certain coder is insane and believes that default means default. Besides, the whole point of the system working like this is so that people don't have to remember how much things cost.
Because people get it wrong.
All the time.
Even staff.
Hopefully between one of the two responses, it answers the question.
--
edit for the edit: Yes, I know that WoD/CoD does not have more than one special XP type, but a) once you start going with multiples it doesn't matter, and b) I don't trust either White Wolf or Onyx Path not to change this for fun.
@Rook said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
@Thenomain
What's wrong withxp/spend <trait>=<value>/<value>
Ambiguous. Needs units.
So here I am, installing server code from a new game, and I find out that @Chime's TinyMUX fork has this gem:
- Contains @raelik's ATCP code.
I look this up. It's apparently GMTP!
And now we know.
@Coin said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
@Lithium said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
for this kind of a situation, I'd actually do something like an XP bank. Where a person could bank xp into a spend. Take Arcane as the running example.
+xp/spend Arcane=6 (to bank 6 xp into it)
+axp/spend Arcane=8 (to bank 8 Arcane xp into it)Then when you hit the magic number needed for an increase, boom, done. You have new level of arcane.
+axp would stand for alternate xp, so could be used for any splat that had something similar.
I am hella in favor of this, to be honest. Especially if it also locked to a Wait Time, so if you paid for it in full before you could actually buy it, it would just say 'you have bought Gnosis 4. It will be available in a week' or whatever.
I'm flagging @Lithium on this too, because people don't get flagged on every nested comment.
The largest problem with that is the current command structure is this:
xp/spend <trait>=<value>
This sets <trait> to <value> using all Normal XP by default.
I'd also want to let someone say, 'Take the rest of it with <type> xp', which would be the default. For (bad) instance:
...
Wait, how about this?
> xp/bank Arcane=6
You have banked 6 Arcane XP into a future spend.
> xp/cost Strength=2
Raising Strength from 1 to 2 would cost 5 Normal XP. Your 6 Arcane XP (banked) would be returned.
> xp/cost Gnosis=4
Raising Gnosis from 3 to 4 would cost 5 Arcane XP (banked). Your 1 Arcane XP would be returned.
> xp/bank
You have banked 6 Arcane XP for your next spend.
> xp/unbank
Unbanking all XP. Your 6 Arcane XP has been returned.
> xp/spend Gnosis=4
You have purchased Gnosis to 4 for 5 XP.
Whups! You spent 5 Normal XP because you unbanked the Arcane XP.
Better? Worse? Generic thoughts from everyone about this?
Then yes, you are also insane. Gratz?
@Sammi said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
The stakes for a user mistake here are really low, so I can't see the argument for needing guard rails around an alternative way of putting in a command.
You and I have very different design goals when it comes to introducing players to a new system, then.
the worst possible outcome is momentary distress for the user and an unintended XP spend
When that distress removes the player from any chance of getting help via the in-game systems, then I consider that a severe design flaw.
--
@Derp said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
@Thenomain said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
You and I are few of the insane people who have read the enirety of the MUX help files.
I read help.txt and wizhelp.txt. Does that count?
I once printed them out and read it at work at a job where most of my job was waiting for something to happen.
To be honest, though, I've been looking at @program for a variety of things. I think it could be very useful. It would take a while for people to adjust to, but for things like, say, Mage spellcasting, where a variety of factors have to be taken into account? It could be invaluable.
Oh I'm not saying that @program doesn't have its place, but that it has higher design considerations since it's not a standard interface. And even if so, one game's program interface could be entirely different than another's, raising the initial learning curve.
@Sparks said in Dead Celebrities: 2017 Edition:
Steven Furst, a.k.a. Flounder in Animal House, and Vir Cotto on Babylon 5.
This scene probably made Babylon 5 one of the best, if not the best, sci-fi series of all time.
RIP Steven Furst.
@Coin said in Guilty Pleasures:
(P.S. 'your mom is objectively awesome' would have been better, here. Nice try, young Padawan.)
Feeling guilty for enjoying your mom is more apropos.
@Coin said in Guilty Pleasures:
It's only a guilty pleasure if it isn't objectively awesome.
Your mom isn't objectively awesome.
@icanbeyourmuse said in Lords and Ladies Game:
@kitteh Same (not counting missing poses in large scenes.)
This is a constant obstacle for me. One of the flags for "friend material" is someone who doesn't flip out if I miss mention of my character in a pose. They will page or even publicly mention it, which is fine. It happens.
To some of us it happens a lot.
@VulgarKitten
I would RP with you there but I've been tacitly banned from Arx, sssssssoooooooo...
@Sammi said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
@Thenomain said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
The "inadvertent" part is that people probably don't know what they're locked out of when they start it.
If the helpfile says that it locks you out of everything, and the syntax is such that nobody's going to enter the lockout through a typo, the remainder is analogous to someone who sees "hot surface" and decides to touch it to verify if the sign is accurate.
@icanbeyourmuse
My proactivity is to throw hooks into scene sets. The intent is to say, "Are you interested in this?" I personally love it when someone else offers to set a new scene because I am absolutely horrible at it, but I try to thank them by diving right into whatever they've offered.
And that's a lot of what this hobby is about. You don't just pick and choose who you will and won't interact with, but you are there to start a communication about what that means, though poses and scene sets if you'd like, or through OOC pages and forum discussions. Hell, even the game you log into says a lot of what you're looking for.
If you're having trouble getting involved, saying it's you is fine, by the way. Even saying it's the game is fine, because most of us are adults and understand what you mean. You can reach out and let others decide whether or not they are going to help you specifically get involved, or work with you to find the hooks that you are looking for.
Nobody has a system that absolutely works. It takes all of us to make a good game culture.
@Catsmeow said in Guilty Pleasures:
But is this love or just a game?
What is love?
Baby don't hurt me.
Don't hurt me no more.
The problem I see with using @program is that you cannot use any of the standard commands, not that you'll enter it by accident. You cannot page someone or use channels while in a @program, which are things that people might want to use to get help with the program. (Note:I haven't checked this decade, so maybe it's changed.)
The "inadvertent" part is that people probably don't know what they're locked out of when they start it.
--
I am thinking about the other "build-based" system, just letting it float in my brain a bit.
@Sammi said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
Just to be different: I could see a world in which some people prefer to use a syntax that explicitly drops them into a prompt that captures all of their input. For example, this would be faster than typing it all out:
Didn't you upvote this? ::
@Thenomain said in Straw Poll: XP Spending in nWoD/CoD:
One of the things that
@program
does is lock the player into no other input. If you're in the middle of this, you cannot type, say, 'p staff=Hey, question!'
I would really like to avoid that part. Maybe I have no imagination when it comes to input, but inadvertently locking someone out of responding to any other input but not stopping the other input doesn't feel like a good idea.
Like every time I hit the backtick (`) in Mass Effect: Andromeda, engaging console mode, and start yelling at the screen, "Why is nothing responding!" Or when I get locked into a conversation in Mass Effect: Andromeda and start yelling at the screen, "Why are you letting these people attack me!"
I know where you and @ThatOneDude were going for, and as someone who learned how to program for a terminal (CICS mmmmm, crunchy), I get it. I just can't see it working. If I'm missing some core component to this that would make it work without the lockout, I could give it a try. Maybe a less than non-useful 'Huh?' message. You know, like, "Huh? (You're trying to type things; if you want to quit this type 'nuh-uh' and you can get back to the main game.)" This would involve absorbing everything. I mean $*:@pemit %#=Nope!
style everything. I've done this. Er, once.
@Catsmeow said in Date Thenomain:
@Thenomain said in Date Thenomain:
It'd be like hiring Tim Burton to direct, say, the movie adaptation of Mama Mia.
I'd totally watch that.
Well yeah, but if you're the owners of the musical who licensed it out, you're probably on the phone yelling at someone.
@Gingerlily said in Date Thenomain:
It's not a movie snob for me thing either, I just get overstimulated too easily and movies already have a lot of visual stuff going on on a large screen plus a lot of sound. I don't need even more things for my eyes to process. So I'm not into it.
Trust the director as you would a writer, or artist, or production company. Giving you a good experience is part of her or his job. The other part is to make money for the people paying said her or him. I am constantly surprised when any studio hires M. Night Shamalan to do anything than moody tension pieces. It'd be like hiring Tim Burton to direct, say, the movie adaptation of Mama Mia. Or Joss Wheedon to write a male empowerment movie.
Not that they can't, but I'd be worrying.