Still not dead. 
What was a trip to the ER Friday became admitted to the hospital that night with surgery at the crack of dawn and another scheduled for the next few weeks. Then was nahhhhhhhhhhh all in one stay Because Important Reasons, moar surgery on Thursday (hopefully all the rest, but if it isn't, remaining would be super minor). And then X days of recovery.
My goal for this year: get wayyyyyyyy better at planning my time, because this is silly even for me.
I still can't post on this phone for shit but bear with me.
Please note that as in the reality of events vs. their television counterparts or would be television counterparts, the prevalence of "fuck", and actual references to oompa-loompas is probably greatly exaggerrated.
Have no idea how long I will have to be here still, as 'has not died' is not 'is not at a disturbingly high risk of dying if a hair of something goes wrong with first surgery' are not the same thing.
Still do not want to hear wiki help reqs or invites to places or get questions about general game shit, because being in a life or death disaster? Zero patience right now for the kind of thing people dress up as such being flung my way. (See? I to take my mental health seriously, too.) That particular shit will hit a fan -- forcibly spattering the flinger.
Otherwise, all the Be good to each other, people.
I don't think the one we went to here was $5, unfortunately.
I still kinda like Checkers for burgers. It depends on the location, though; some are more/less greasepit than others and I prefer the 'slightly less'. I have to ask they leave off tons of stuff, but the meat tastes like meat, they don't skimp on bacon or beef, and that alone is <3.
I am that sensitive stomach meat and cheese person who typically has to skip on anything else, so the times they fuck up are sigh-worthy because there's no amount of wiping that will get mayo off a thing, but the times they don't screw up are <3.
@Kanye-Qwest said in Dealing with Staff:
Everyone is a dick when they aren't getting their way.
Not remotely true in my experience.
And a bad generalization to make, if by making it, you're going to read dickery into every reply to a 'no', especially in a text-based environment in which we have a lot of information loss due to tone.
Good luck, @Auspice! I am finally heading off to docland today myself.
I can now add 'am neon fucking yellow' to the list of issues, though, which pleases me none.
@Kanye-Qwest said in Sensitive cultural/political/religious aspects of game themes.:
@roz Honestly I'm happy to say that pretty early in the discussion, if the topic is one I know we aren't going to budge on. Like hey, your opinion is noted, but this is just not going to change.
At least in terms of this thread, there's no intention of selling any viewpoint or whatever else. I'm interested in what changes (if any) and choices were made, and why. That's really it.
@Kanye-Qwest That's 'bitching about it being silly'. Hell, I do that, too.
That's different from saying 'they shouldn't allow that to happen because it corrupts the purity of the setting by skewing it too far into unrealistic territory', however.
@Derp said in Sensitive cultural/political/religious aspects of game themes.:
All I was saying is that it seemed like a question was being asked, and then when people gave some responses, it came off like "I already have my answer for sensitive subjects".
I get this, but I wasn't asking 'just for me'; the time I've done that was to put the basics of a former site in progress to ask for input. This was spawned by the reactions to some of the setting elements in the ShadowhuntersMUSH thread, specifically. That larger conversation would be kinda crappy for everyone to have (re: 'how have other games handled similiar issues like this one?') in somebody's ad thread and it was veering that way fast.
Of course they can create the game they want. I was simply confused on why ask an opinion if you already know what you're going to do.
I don't do design by committee when the committee is a free-for-all. That way lies madness. Never have and never will. That doesn't mean that engaging in conversation about how other games have handled this (we've had historical games, how have they tackled it?/why do people feel the way they do about the Shadowhunters setting?/Do people typically want games to be sanitized for modern sensibilities?/etc.) isn't illuminating.
I also feel it would be a bit shit-heel-ish if I didn't mention what I intend to do, but only in the context of as one of many, because I'm not of a mind to ask people to share information I'm not willing to share myself.
Personally, I think that the things listed as 'what I'm actually wanting answers for' are... honestly, minutiae. There's no one good way to handle it. Someone's feathers are always going to get ruffled on those. And it sounds like you'd prefer to just use a prefs system to handle them anyway, so...
Personally?
The most useful post here for me in this context was from @GangOfDolls, describing the experience of her friend who was setting a game during a time and in a place in which slavery was part of that society, and the options and considerations they had to contend with in doing so. So far as I can tell, no one much responded to that, but that is an entirely different sort of decision-making process than just policy-making around an issue, it's a setting design consideration.
The other was @faraday's post about 'if it existed, it will be allowed', and that typical skewing the PC pool toward exceptions, its impact on the game, and the discussion that followed. I find it a little weird that people take such issue with this, since almost every game suffers from this issue; TR and FC hole-in-the-wall parts of the northeast are not, generally, overflowing with celebrities and endless billionaires and typically higher-than-book-average percentages of supernaturals for the size of the population, but I don't see folks generally insisting they not be allowed to make those characters because the representations of the mundane human population is not proportionally accurate.
Specifically, it's sensitive cultural/political/religious concerns. As related to fantasy worlds and historical games that may, or may not, include these themes as part of the setting. Not just 'anything someone might possibly be sensitive about', which is literally anything.
I will be clear here, and possibly more than a little blunt: if someone things they can force a sexual preference change, romantic relationship, sexual assault, pregnancy, a forced template (in this case type) change that may require them to freeze that alt or another, completely rewrite another player character's personality into something they have no interest in playing, or force the player into taboo sex (bestiality, incest, snuffsex, etc.) just because they want to, with zero fucks given for the experience of the other player whose fun is as important as theirs is? They have no place on any game I put together. ^ Those are the consent subjects.
You're still conflating 'consent subjects' and 'preferences', after I was pretty clear that, no, they are not the same thing. The only reason they came up is because @Ominous decided that 'rape' was the same thing. Maybe to them, it is, no skin off my nose either way. In the context of what I am doing, it is functionally not the same thing.
@Derp said in Sensitive cultural/political/religious aspects of game themes.:
@surreality
For instance, what if, say, your PC is playing the town sheriff, but has NOPE listed for, I don't know, violence? (Probably not going to be as dramatic as that, but it's just an example). How do those stories move forward? Do you create an NPC? What happens to the person who trusted that this sheriff would handle it? What happens to the multitude of NPC's who elected them to do the same? If you tell the player they're not a good fit for the position, aren't you in fact violating their prefs and such as well?
I regard this in the same way I regard pharmacists who refuse to distribute birth control or similar products 'because it goes against their beliefs': they shouldn't have that fucking job. You don't get to fuck others over or disregard an aspect of play critical to the position you want to take on to the detriment of a large segment of the playerbase. Similarly, you couldn't sign on to play a madam and refuse to have anything to do with prostitution ever.
I don't think that a 'get out of things free' card is really going to help you more than it hurts you.
I've stated repeatedly: that is not remotely how it works. For consent-required subjects, yes; not for preferences. There are 6 consent-required subjects that have nothing whatsoever to do with this topic (and only came up because someone wanted to equate it to rape, which is handled differently, as stated before) and about 30 or so various preferences people can set. The consent-required ones are repeated in the prefs simply because it's a convenient place to get that information out there in advance to make people aware, but consent is not required for every possible preference.
@Kanye-Qwest I didn't exactly plan to break a rib and tear several muscles between then and now from violent projectile vomiting. Not exactly something one pencils into their schedule. 
<raises a hand> I am a little testy because painkillers and, well, pain. Just want to note this because I may be coming off snarlier than I intend, since it's kinda hard to see straight at the moment and I'm keeping things a bit short (for me anyway).
@Kanye-Qwest said in Sensitive cultural/political/religious aspects of game themes.:
@surreality said in Sensitive cultural/political/religious aspects of game themes.:
@Ominous That's not quite what's set up, though. That's not the setup for rape at all, in fact. That's a full consent subject. There's a preference, too, where someone can state 'OK with it' or 'not OK with it' in advance, but it's a full consent subject that cannot be brought up around people who are explicitly not OK with it.
How is this ensured/enforced? Because I can foresee a lot of issues if, mid scene, Jane is suddenly put on the spot to say "Oh I don't want to see this or rp about it, check my +preferences".
That's back to the rape question, I gather? That never goes public. Ever. If people want to play it privately, they can. This is not about the rape question, however.
Beyond that, it's not like it's hard to +prefs <name> or skim a wiki page before initiating a scene with someone. Years on Shang have shown people absolutely do skim preference information (in their form, +kinks) before initiating a scene with someone almost by rote; it is exceedingly rare when they don't do so when that information is available.
How do you keep your game consistent if you are going to have stories that some undefined portion of your PC population just gets to say "nah, I'm going to pretend that's not going on" to?
Other than consent-required subjects, it's going on. Theme/setting elements do not get ignored. How much one chooses to interact with those aspects of the game is what that preference is for. It is not a sweeping declaration that historical prejudices simply don't exist in their world, but that they do not want all of their roleplay to be unrealistically wedged into being only that in their play experience.
How does that actually protect people who don't want to rp those themes, if they are still going to be exposed to them and are going to have to bow out of storylines? How does it free up people who DO want to pursue those themes if they have to check with every PC that might eventually be drawn in to make sure they are ok with the subject matter?
Because we are adults, in the end. Yes, it exists in the world. No, you shouldn't be forced to make it the sole or primary focus of your roleplay. This is really not remotely hard. If someone is forcing these things down someone's throat repeatedly, and we hear about it, they will be warned to stop, then shown the door if they don't, or if they behave like a screeching howler monkey when told to knock it off.
For a sandboxy game? Sure, whatever. For a game where you are trying to tell a story and keep players from all 'spheres' involved in it, I don't think that's going to play out anywhere as cleanly as you'd hope.
This is not WoD, and there are no spheres.
Over the past 20 years, I have seen no end of drama emerge from 'I've been triggered! ASSHOLE!' and 'I had no idea that was a trigger, shit, I am so sorry!' -- which is shit for all involved, and is, to put it bluntly, a giant drama factory. If this reduces that kind of drama by so much as 20% because people are made aware, I'll consider it to be a roaring success.
@Ominous That's not quite what's set up, though. That's not the setup for rape at all, in fact. That's a full consent subject. There's a preference, too, where someone can state 'OK with it' or 'not OK with it' in advance, but it's a full consent subject that cannot be brought up around people who are explicitly not OK with it.
re: Pref trollng: People who troll that way we will simply show the door without much ceremony.
Mutual respect is key on any game. Both sides are expected to give a little. If one person keeps strongarming their crap on others, they will simply be gone. Most players will understand that everyone's fun matters, and everyone's sensitivities -- if they are aware of them, which this does ensure -- should not be trod on in a cavalier fashion. If someone can't behave like an adult in this fashion, and takes an 'all about me' approach, they won't likely last very long.
@Tinuviel Eh, I'd count it under a well-known cultural icon, really. It isn't a person, but it is a celebrated part of culture.
@Tinuviel I'd say it could count, in a sense. It's still a cultural icon, even if not a person, and there's a genuine loss whenever we lose one of those.
@GangOfDolls I would wait a few years, honestly, to see what the market does, even if that advice feels stymying and awful.
That is generally not a trend destined to last forever, and it would suck really hard to be paying today's price on a property that you would not be able to recoup when it does eventually drop back to the norm if/when you decide to sell.
@TNP Sadly, not yet. He apparently still wasn't having any luck with it while I was crashed out, but will be able to get the info required first thing tomorrow morning from his boss.
We are setting up an appointment with our normal doc who saw me pre-insurance and was always flexible with stuff anyway, because he's genuinely a good soul and does whatever he can to help us out. So at least there will be something, and ideally by the time it gets to xrays and whatever else, we'll have the info we need.
@TNP Will prod him on this. They kept asking for his name on the phone line recording... he'd go through all the stuff, and then get 'we're sorry, our office hours are... ' with every number they had, which is weirdly terrifying.
@TNP I will pass that along to him, because seriously... I need to get this looked at.