Vietnam War MUSH

[Seraphim73]

@KDraygo said in Vietnam War MUSH:

There was nothing good about the Vietnam War to play about.

Unless it's Aliens.

[Tinuviel]

I... honestly don't know how one could remove the racial concerns from the Vietnam time period or anything inspired by it. Modern history isn't really my forte, but I'm fairly sure the war had black people in it and that it was influenced by (and in turn itself influenced) the Civil Rights Movement back home.

You might be great at concept theory... but not at knowing what all the words you're putting together actually mean.

[Chet]

Speaking from categorical statistics, a lower proportion of African-Americans died in the Vietnam War than whites. In fact, most of the KIA Americans were college educated, specifically warrant officers attached to flight or flight upkeep of helicopters, that's an ROTC training brigade, and the soldiers deployed to Vietnam had the highest highschool graduate rate, and the highest Caucasian enlistment per capita of municipal origin, of any margin until that point.

Furthermore, Martin Luther King Jr.'s affiliation with the anti-war movement, is commonly correlated with the loss of popularity the Civil Rights Movement experienced, often misconstrued in media duet o the influence of Jewish talent houses that seek to draw in voters via media ventures for payment of international trade deals overseas, as various broker (that's the middleman, the fixer acts on commission per deal exchequer arranged) dealers for international diplomacy, a necessary fixture of international commerce.

Not to say it's a particular conspiracy of one group, simply the placement of profit model among a specialization of community to offer financial profit, thereby being prolonging of the industry and culture's financial leverage point inside the talent "corridor", the means of influence.

Bollywood is attempting to create a competing model, alongside the Buddhist League, an organization of Zazen derived actors, actresses, directors, stuntmen, choreographers, etc., that works in retaliations for crimes against individual Buddhists, particularly if the crime occurs in a publicly palletable manner.

Bollywood would be the province of D-Company and other Hindu syndicates, the centerpoint of international commerce finance in theology since the United Nations' inception.

[Tinuviel]

@Chet Oh, honey. No. No.

[Chet]

@Tinuviel I got my Ikagawa-kai scar on my right inner arm, man, it's all good.

[Cupcake]

@Chet

[Wizz]

Chet, a lot of what you say is just word salad to the rest of us. I dunno if you only come here when you're manic or what, but it doesn't seem particularly healthy.

[JinShei]

@Chet You know that the Americans weren't the only people involved, right? That the horrible racist overtones might not be about the Americans? Honestly, mate, this is a terrible idea, full of potential horrors and ghastliness which would keep this forum active for pages and pages. Put it down, walk away, pretend you never suggested it.

[Selira]

As the child of a Vietnam vet, please, no, no, never, no. The only way I can see themes of that war being justifiable in a game are if you basically strip them of all real-world connotation, which a lot of sci-fi from that period did, and the heavy themes of isolation and disconnect almost need direct, constant involvement by a GM.

Tabletop, maybe. Not MU.

The trauma of that war is still too real, it's absolutely impossible to tackle the race issue well, and the stories to be told are stories that largely amount to constantly finding out about the horrors of human existence. That's it.

As for the word salad, @Chet, please remember that jargon is not key to effective communication outside of the specialized group fluent in that jargon. If you can't explain your ideas in a clear way that people can understand, you probably don't actually have a firm grasp of your ideas.

[TiredEwok]

@Selira

This is why I said what I said about how I didn't think it'd be well received. Were/are all wars bad? Yes, but it seems like the Vietnam War was particularly so (I was born about a month after the war supposedly ended, and my memory for historical facts is shoddy af, so I remember very little of the actual details about it, I have to admit). I don't think this is a subject that should be broached at all, even in loose/broad strokes.

[Ganymede]

@Selira said in Vietnam War MUSH:

As for the word salad, @Chet, please remember that jargon is not key to effective communication outside of the specialized group fluent in that jargon. If you can't explain your ideas in a clear way that people can understand, you probably don't actually have a firm grasp of your ideas.

I'll take "Shit They Don't Teach in Law School" for $200, Alex.

[Testament]

Also a child of Vietnam vet, and I can tell you that there are distinct why my dad doesn't talk about what happened over there. While I personally find that time in history from an investigative stand point, one that I think Ken Burns documentary did an amazing job breaking everything that caused and the fallout of the war, by no means do I believe it needs to be played out in a mush setting.

I fully believe and encourage people to read into Vietnam from an educational standpoint, as I do believe it's something important that literally every person can take something away from. And not always positive, more of a reminder.

But it should not be played out. There are far too many sticky, complicated subject matter and if you disentangle that from the war itself, not only is it not representing the actual thing, but reenactment of itself I would wonder is insulting to the people, on every side, who suffered the horrors of the real thing.

Speaking personally, if I told my dad that I'm playing on a game that depicted Vietnam, he'd likely be very disappointed. It's not something that should ever be played as a game. But stand as a lesson to history.

Then again, I have two relatives on the wall at the Vietnam Memorial, and I can't help but think that emulating anything coming close to it is distasteful.

[Macha]

Chiming in as another child of a Vietnam Vet. My father never recovered from his time there. He fell in love with the food, the languages, and admittedly the women (He thought Vietnamese and Thai women are the most beautiful in the world). As a history major, I was always fascinated by the time, and he would never talk to me about it.

He developed a medical condition while over there, that never went away. He had nightmares. He lost friends.

So while it is a fascinating time, it's not really a 'game' friendly theme, I don't think.

[Tinuviel]

@Macha said in Vietnam War MUSH:

So while it is a fascinating time, it's not really a 'game' friendly theme, I don't think.

It could be, under very strict circumstances of a small group interacting with the world itself. More of an online TableTop sort of deal rather than a MU. It would need to be based on trust and understanding and an exceedingly limited number of participants with active GM involvement.

[Wizz]

@Ganymede said in Vietnam War MUSH:

@Selira said in Vietnam War MUSH:

As for the word salad, @Chet, please remember that jargon is not key to effective communication outside of the specialized group fluent in that jargon. If you can't explain your ideas in a clear way that people can understand, you probably don't actually have a firm grasp of your ideas.

I'll take "Shit They Don't Teach in Law School" for $200, Alex.

Yeah, word salad doesn't mean technical jargon. It's a psychiatric term for the sort of incoherent non-sequiturs people with severe mental illnesses like schizophrenia or dementia say sometimes.

[Ghost]

@Chet said in Vietnam War MUSH:

It was Wing Commander: Red Horizon's under-theme, for me, and I'd love to see a new one. Space: Above and Beyond, maybe, where you could play a USMC unit, fighting charlie, in the jungle?

Suggestion: Don't use racial slurs.

You might have had some people with "Space: Above and Beyond" but when you suggest a Vietnam War MU as a possible idea alongside fighting charlie (<---racial slur) you present an environment that would recreate the Vietnam War alongside the anti-Asian sentiment/prejudice simply by invoking the term "charlie".

There's no place for racism in Mu.

[GangOfDolls]

I'm not wholely unconvinced that this isn't a troll topic intended to manufacture outrage. In any case, this is a terribad idea.

[Ghost]

@GangOfDolls Not disagreeing. Seems like bait to get into politics, which if I read last page of responses correctly, turned into just that.

I broke my 4+ month post abstinence merely to point out that I wasn't sure if people missed that he called it: "fighting charlie".

[Ganymede]

@Ghost said in Vietnam War MUSH:

I broke my 4+ month post abstinence merely to point out that I wasn't sure if people missed that he called it: "fighting charlie".

Some people still call it "the China Virus," so I guess I just tuned that shit out.

[Wizz]

@GangOfDolls said in Vietnam War MUSH:

I'm not wholely unconvinced that this isn't a troll topic intended to manufacture outrage. In any case, this is a terribad idea.

In his defense, I don't think he's trolling. Chet's been coming here for a couple of years now trying to get something off the ground, and most of his ideas have been this weird or weirder.

Also, he did clarify on the first page that (despite the thread title) he wasn't talking about making a literal Vietnam War game, just a sci-fi setting that resembles it.

ETA: I mean to say, I don't think he's being deliberately terrible, he just seems ill.