@Rook said in MU and Alternate Channels:
You are responsible for your behavior and actions at all times.
I follow a similar maxim, said another way:
Don't write something or message someone electronically with something you would not want someone to see as an exhibit in court.
@Rook said in A Constructive Thread About People We Might Not Like:
This thread was started to level the conversation into greyness, so as to allow for abstract discussion. I think it can be agreed that the case in which we are specifically referring to is an extreme outlier to this conversation, yes?
I've been saying this for a while, actually, and in response to your concern regarding the Court of Public Opinion and blacklisting.
I don't remember which game you defended, Rook, but I've always advised staffers not to defend their policies or decisions. More often than not, you are shouting into a cacophony of ignorant noise. It is advisable to correct people who state blatantly false statements or premises regarding a decision, but unless a policy is so bizarre and indefensible so as to warrant an echo chamber of mockery, you will likely find one, two, or three people that will take up the mantle and vociferously defend your decision without you saying a word.
In the past decade or so, I think that players have generally adopted the policy that: (1) staff are responsible for their own games and have the authority to make whatever decisions they want; and (2) policies can be ignored where circumstances demand attention.
That said, I have been a proponent of the benevolent dictatorship.
@Tinuviel said in A Constructive Thread About People We Might Not Like:
If a person has developed a reputation for being hostile, abusive, or the like then they should be ostracized. That's part of how communities self-police. If we want to encourage new blood to enter the hobby, we need to exclude those people that cause the most problems.
This is my response to yours. This is the risk we can present. And so long as problem players can weasel their way back onto games, there are no real consequences for them.
This is why I am ardently pursuing my "crusade."
This is the only time where motorboating a pussy might be acceptable.
@Auspice said in RL things I love:
And here I thought you'd just latch onto the 'boobs' part and glaze over the rest.
He does have two hands.
@Rook said in A Constructive Thread About People We Might Not Like:
Here's a question... how does someone like this come back into the community and NOT try to do so, if their intention is pure and honest, anonymously? Doesn't the consideration of that question lend some credence, one way or the other, to understanding intent?
You could come out and admit your past shitty behavior. @Tinuviel did that at some point, and most people have forgotten what he did. I've done some shit too, and I've been called on it.
The instant person aside, a lot of people have done shit things in their time, and have admitted to the shit they did. And most of us are pretty forgiving people. The unrepentant shits either leave forever (Seanan McGuire) or find some way to worm their way back in. And it is absolutely infuriating that people let the latter happen.
@Cupcake said in Coming Soon: Arx, After the Reckoning:
Would it be wrong of me to hope certain players come back because he's gone?
I would.
@Thenomain said in A Constructive Thread About People We Might Not Like:
Maybe some guilty people should, but this is less treatment and more a movement, building over years. The only other person I can think of who got this treatment is Seanan McGuire, and she went on to become a relatively successful author.
Right. And what did she do? She stayed the fuck away from us. For the most part, we left her alone.
VASpider? Crawls back into the community. And then has the nerve to tell us to leave her alone.
Get out of my fucking bar. You're not welcome.
@Ghost said in A Constructive Thread About People We Might Not Like:
Well, VASpider is just the first one in the stocks.
The fuck she is.
People have bad-mouthed @Tempest. A lot. Yet she hasn't garnered the same amount of discussion. Why? Because she doesn't have a pattern of bad behavior that can be verified by multiple sources who otherwise do not have anything to do with one another.
What about the people who drive some Star Wars to the ground. Rex/Sovereign? Elsa? None of them have risen to this level, but a lot of people have come out against them.
Custodius doesn't even have this level of infamy here.
Innocent people -- even guilty people -- have not gotten the same treatment.
@Ataru said in Fate's Harvest BETA Live (Full Open Soon):
This is why when I first log into a game, I name the charbit Ataru. It might get renamed after I come up with my concept, but I like to be transparent about who I am. If people know me from here and want to say hi, great. I just got into that habit.
I do the same thing. Except I use "Ganymede," of course.
@Ghost said in A Constructive Thread About People We Might Not Like:
I have this habit of typing things that are philosophical in my head, so I should clarify. The purpose behind that comment was to more philosophically ask: "Okay, so you really dislike her, but what's the point in just complaining and avoiding, what's your end game? You either DO something about it, or learn the risk factors and mitigate it."
The only justice we can ever hope for in this hobby is for people to learn their lessons and pass on their wisdom.
That's what I'm doing here.
@Lisse24 said in Good writin'.:
Well then, now I know why I'm not popular and have no following.
I like you.
As for the use of 'Asian' as a descriptor - fair enough. Though in general many people (not all, I am definitely making a generalization here) aren't good at telling the difference between a Korean, Chinese, Japanese, Thai/Viet person, especially at a first glance.
Us "Asian" folks aren't always good at it either, but that does not mean that we appreciate it when people use the term "Asian" or "Oriental" to describe us.
Try "South-East Asian" or "Pacific Asian."
@Auspice said in Fate's Harvest BETA Live (Full Open Soon):
I'll be polite, I'll chat, but the 'OMG YAY CONFETTI BFFS 5EVER' stuff just sets my teeth on edge.
I have not had a direct problem with her in years. Many years.
But I see the pattern.
It starts with activity; activity is good. Then it moves to indispensability; she is the center of plots, as a player or character. Then it moves to responsibility and authority; she becomes a part of staff, and contributes. Then it moves to protectionism; she takes steps to protect her own and her characters' interests. In between these times, there is the gossip, the insinuations, the chit-chatting, all of which seem innocuous but usually end up blacklisting or ostracizing players that would have the gumption to speak out against her.
By the time any staff asses up and knocks her out, their sphere has been gutted as good players have left or clinging players have departed with her.
I'm willing to agree that none of this intentional, but the pattern is there and demonstrable. Not once, not twice, but more than that. So, when she appears on games, I take the hint and duck out: if staff are willing to give her a pass on her past history, they aren't exercising great judgment.
@Auspice said in Fate's Harvest BETA Live (Full Open Soon):
I knew something rubbed me the wrong way about her. I sort of chalked it up to my being jaded and cranky, but there was just a bit too much of the 'this person is putting on way too much of a show of I AM EVERYONE'S BFF while also seeming ultra fake' from her.
She has a persecution complex that's easy for many gamers to initially relate to, until they realize that it is a product of her own repeated patterns of behavior.
@faraday said in Identifying Major Issues:
Where did anyone say requiring an email was a shield against harassment?
It's been brought up in other threads here, but I was directly addressing this:
"And if I'm running a game? Honestly, there are things I will want for my own security and game features that will require this. And if you can't trust me enough to even provide a burner e-mail for that, fine. Play elsewhere. There are other options." (Emphasis added.)
If your game requires the e-mail address for functions to work, that's fine. For the wiki? Cool. But if anyone thinks that the e-mail address will provide some sort of security against harassment, hacking, or whatever, it really won't.
That's all.
@HelloProject said in Identifying Major Issues:
I don't think I understand. You mean geared towards preventing people from being bored rather than enabling people to just go out and do shit?
The opposite. Policies regarding PRPs are often geared to preventing people from going insane shit, and not to enable people to just go out and do shit -- and thereby have fun.
@HelloProject said in Identifying Major Issues:
Like, seeing people get to do insane shit, who are significantly less proactive than me and other people, and I'm just like, twiddling my thumbs wanting to do something super basic that I can't do.
I'm going to hook right here to make a succinct point.
The issue, in my mind, isn't the bolded part; it's the bolded-and-italicized part. This is because, more often than not, the policies are geared to prevent the bolded situation and not to enable the bolded-and-italicized situation.
@Catsnake said in Fate's Harvest BETA Live (Full Open Soon):
I don't have any previous experience with this VASpider that everyone talks about here but she is apparently back to playing (after some sort of hiatus I guess?) on this chat. Evidence of such, her reblogging/vouching for/liking stuff from the site's tumblr onto her own. https://vaspider.tumblr.com/post/160786811941/were-back. And a link to a tumblr she reblogged/advertised art for on her character's wiki.
Seriously? VASpider's playing here?
Can anyone confirm/deny this?
There are some good points here. In the past 10 minutes, I've also scratched at my head. Where to start? Or start at all?
One of the marquee things about the Internet was the fact that it was relatively anonymous. I picked the handle of Ganymede almost 20 years ago, and it's the only thing that has stuck. I've shifted e-mail addresses and characters more times than hair colors. And I'm not the same person I was back when I first called myself "Ganymede, the Sexless Wonder."
I no longer see a need for e-mails. It's a requirement that can be easily worked around, so it provides no real sense of security. Much like "gun-free zones," there's a strong argument that assholes don't really pay attention to what they are told not to do, and will do things because they want to. Any staff member who thinks requiring an e-mail address will be a shield against harassment is naïve.
I side with @WTFE regarding the reticence of staff to provide on-grid support for PrPs. I side with @Thenomain that the bureaucracy that comes with these, in the name of "fairness," is generally discouraging. I side with @Derp in that, in many cases, the bureaucracy is not an actual barrier to entry. In the end, though, I see the issue as, simply: why don't I get to do what those people are doing?
Why can't you blow up part of the Grid? Because Sally Sits-In-OOC didn't think of it first. Why is there a cry for fairness? Because Mopey Murphy wants what Alice Active has worked with staff to get. Why does it seem to be a barrier to entry? Because Larry Lazypants can't be bothered to put together a two paragraph summary. And whatever is permissible or fair or paralyzing changes from game to game, player to player.
It goes to planning. Planning, planning, planning. With that comes understanding the system and its objective. Too often, systems are shoe-horned into settings with themes that are incompatible. And the rationale of "the players want this!" rings in me with the same strength as "the client wants this!" or "this sounds like a good idea because my kids want it."
We've identified the issue. Planning means devising a method to address the issues in a manner that each person working on a project can agree with. Those methods will differ from person to person, but there is a certain amount of strength in that diversity.
