Posts made by Arkandel

@Thenomain I am not afraid to say this:

It is easy to converse with people who are in complete agreement with you.

@Ganymede said in The basketball thread:

@Arkandel said in The basketball thread:

Maybe I'm projecting but aside from the Spurs (Leonard/DMC+Pop will keep them going for a while) and of course the Warriors (... what the hell) I'd like to see a league led by completely new contenders.

Then cheer for Toronto. Because, what the fuck, when did they become perennial contenders?

My coworkers practically live in Jurassic Park. But the issue with the Raps is... they are soft. I'd like to see them at least get to the Conference Finals (although it'd mean losing a bet and buying lunch) but they have a sad history of crumbling in the playoffs.

@Ganymede Maybe I'm projecting but aside from the Spurs (Leonard/DMC+Pop will keep them going for a while) and of course the Warriors (... what the hell) I'd like to see a league led by completely new contenders.

The Timberwolves for sure, the Bucks if they can actually get some shooters and spread the court (Giannis is, naturally, my overall favorite player in the league), perhaps the Lakers given they are the freakin' Lakers and if they attract 1-2 good free agents and get a good coach and get a good front office and get lucky they can maybe perhaps not suck.

... Meh, the Lakers.

@Ganymede said in The basketball thread:

But I see no reason to believe they can, or will, unseat a dynasty team like the Spurs.

Tthibodeau is that reason! The Spurs didn't simply happen, they evolved because Popovich was there to cultivate the team.

I have very high hopes for this squad because of him. Also don't forget their most likely high draft pick this year, which can round up the squad considerably.

@Ganymede Ah, but the Bulls had a much worse bench - probably the product of a not-exactly-ideal front office - which led to their stars being overused in the regular season, which in turn combined with a reportedly iffy medical staff led to injuries.

Thib's defensive mindfulness combined with a much richer, younger roster than the Bulls bad at their core in their DRose years before his knees exploded, the upcoming draft pick and the fact they will quite likely get the time to gel before expectations mount too high gives me a lot of hope. KAT is amazing, the guy looks like Anthony Davis but healthier and surrounded by actual talent. Even Rubio (a veteran at 25!) is an old-school pass-first playmaker which actually fits this group very well I think, and he's one of the league's best peripheral defenders to boot.

If they stay healthy they will be contenders for sure.

I value dialogue more than I do almost anything else. It's one of the foundation stones of civilization - we must be able to talk to each other even if we come from different places to begin with.

In the context of conversation it doesn't matter to me who I'm talking to; it's irrelevant if I like you or you like me, what your race or political affiliations are, if we have a past or not... I strive to be civil not for your sake or for my own but because that's the only way I know to be respectful to the act of exchanging ideas and viewpoints itself. I'd like to think that expecting the same courtesy isn't done out of spite or entitlement but perhaps I am wrong.

Either way I did not mean to offend anyone and I apologize since I seem to have done so. I just wanted to understand and maybe help out as I could. If it makes it any better perhaps I know more now than I did coming into the thread even if the route there was unexpected.

The Thimberwolves are a thing!

This team, based on a 21-year old Wiggins and 20-year old KAT is going to be scary as hell in 2-3 seasons. They even get a pretty good chance at a nice draft pick this year, although it doesn't seem to be a very deep pool to begin with.

@deadculture said in RL Anger:

@Arkandel Was there any intention on the thief's part to pay? And I am sad your father was forced to leave the union because everyone else was corrupt. Not a good situation to be in.

I really can't say. I was pretty young when it happened and afterwards we (obviously) didn't have anything to do with him again so I never knew him well. I mean I'm sure he would have paid something but of course that doesn't matter - not to mention there was no way to even tell how much he had stolen at that time.

What hurt my dad the most was the lack of support from his friends. They took sides and made the wrong choice.

People can be real assholes.

@Vorpal said in RL Anger:

Let me give you an example. My father worked in the government for several years- he was one of the people who fought to bring updated hydroelectric energy to the country. After many years of that, he returned to the private sector to work. For many years the rumor that kept going around in my father’s circle of acquaintances was “Nicolas is very smart! He’s keeping all that money he stole while in his government position hidden. Very clever of him.”

Eventually, after a decade of that alleged money not surfacing and my father’s lifestyle not reflecting that of a millionaire’s, those acquaintances realized that my father had, in fact, not stolen any money while in the government.

The consensus? That my father was an idiot.

Ouch.

Yeah, systematized, widespread corruption is terrible especially after it's been going on for a while (meaning generations) since it comes to be the norm and no one expects things to get better; worse, people who don't want to be part of that system either do so or are actually penalized for their lack of participation.

My father was one of the founders of a local grocery store union when I was a kid. It became successful and as it started to expand until it had a couple of hundred members they elected him as its first president.

A couple of years into the position they called him over to resolve an 'incident'. Basically one of his oldest friends, a founding member as well, was discovered stealing from the central warehouse - basically he had a hidden compartment in his van where he had been stashing extra items, possibly all along, every day he went in to pick up his normal purchases.

Since that person was prominent and a friend of theirs the others of that small circle asked my dad to look the other way and let the guy pay for what he had been stealing all that time if he promised to not do it again. He refused, called the police, and that person went to jail.

As a result they turned on my father for being a 'traitor'. His own old buddies of his wouldn't talk to him, the atmosphere was pretty unpleasant, so in the end he had to step down and eventually left the union he helped build. When a few years later the other guy got out of prison they invited him back.

It's what it is, you know?

@Ganymede said in RL Anger:

@Coin said in RL Anger:

You can't distill that into something as niche as your example, especially because your example lacks the social bias of privilege that one group has over the other. You're stripping that aspect from the conversation with your example and thus making your example moot.

"Moot" isn't the word your looking for here; "inapplicable" or "not analogous" are better choices.

Still, @Arkandel has a point, and it is this: it is difficult to motivate someone to engage in a serious conversation or discussion by using pejoratives or put-downs.

I think we have thoroughly discussed why "Not All Men" and "All Lives Matter" are offensive to marginalized groups.

So, back to trying to come up with solutions: how do we try and address what appears to be an ingrained mentality in our community?

Pejoratives or put-downs?

It ranges from circle-jerking mockery ('shhh...'), implications of outright participation in abuse for asking questions ('do your research!') , aphorisms instead of arguments ('I'm pretty sure you are wrong') to this:

Fuck you.

That's a level of conversation I don't intend to participate in. I'm out.

@Coin said in RL Anger:

DOUBLEPOST.

P.S. Are you saying that #notallmen isnt' the sort of thing that is distracting and derails a conversation regarding this topic? Because I'm pretty sure that's exactly what it is and what it does.

Well, if you are pretty sure then I guess that's the end of the debate.

Since this is a gaming forum I hope you don't mind if I frame the same thing in slightly different terms to perhaps better portray where I'm getting at, @Apos.

Let's say you were treated horribly by staff at a MU*. You came here and made a post about it, to which I responded "oh, that sucks. Yeah, that happens and it shouldn't. At least on the game I play I haven't noticed it happening, and if it did I'd have said something and done what I could to fix it - or walked away".

To begin with this is not in any way a dismissal if I immediately acknowledge such things do happen, they are undeserved, wrong, and should stop. It's a fact there are places where staff is made of terrible and possibly mentally unstable people.

Now... your concern still makes me think - and isn't that the point of raising it in the first place? To make people question what they think they know? So I start wondering that perhaps even on the game I happen to be playing bad things also happen that have escaped my notice; so I ask if you could tell me what I should be watching for. What forms does abuse take? How is it perpetuated, what would be a good way for me to be involved in actively trying to make it happen less?

And in response you tell me I'm part of the problem. Any argument, question or statement I make that doesn't agree 100% with exactly what you think I should be saying results in a condemnation (or a lol-downvote) on general principle.

Obviously such things won't make me care less. No matter what anyone says on either side (?) of this matter I won't suddenly go 'hey, people who have been treated like shit by staff are treating me like I'm the enemy so I'll side with the abusers', since that'd be dumb. But it does make me want to participate in the conversation less - who wants to be painted in such a light? - and it doesn't accomplish what I came to the thread asking for in the first place; information, insights and honest dialogue.

</endExample>

@lordbelh said in I will design you a MUX:

If you set your expectations to Popular Culture Historical (as imagined by tv, moveies and pulp fiction) I think you're fine. If you try to be authentic as opposed to mere plausible, you're going to go mad. It'll also be a very tiny game. Further more you should pick both a setting and a time that is familiar.

I think the key phrase should be "inspired by". Anything else leads to madness, hilarity and/or frustration.

@Kanye-Qwest said in RL Anger:

Arkandel got one too, don't feel lonely!

You sure showed us.

There is just enough of a smudge of passive hostility in response to the very hint of disagreement with you @Lithium that it makes me not want to engage you in conversation. You seem to recite talking points and resort to petty attacks ("reading comprehension 101", really?) instead of trying to honestly talk to others who go out of their way to have a reasonable discussion with you.

I realize it's an emotionally charged issue. I realize you have strong opinions. That shouldn't stand in the way of a civilized conversation. If you can't talk here with well meaning individuals without the implied suggestion they just can't understand - or, worse, are on the other side of the argument if not potentially against it, even while they invited it in the first place - then there isn't enough trust to make it worth anyone's time.

You are alienating me. Perhaps others. Why?

@silentsophia said in RL Anger:

@Arkandel It's sort of a lose-lose scenario. Why is the victim at an onus to have to leave? It really isn't fair, but if someone is popular and has a lot of power, there's not much else you can really do.

I absolutely agree. It does suck and you (the generic you) shouldn't have to.

What I was saying is that at least the option exists. Online no one can force you to stay somewhere you don't want to be and do something you don't want to do, unlike in real life.

@Misadventure said in RL Anger:

Is there anything we can do to change either of those things in the online RP hobby?

Online has the theoretical advantage of things being easier to track and verify at least. Hearsay and faked logs are still a factor but not to the extent of the verbal word's he-said she-said.

On the other hand there are fewer venues for discourse. HM and whatsisface in the Mage sphere being condoned by staff forever is a prime example, and if staff won't do something... it's not like you can go to the authorities about it.

On the other other hand physical abuse is a non-entity. If things get bad the option to walk might not be attractive but it is an option.

My issue - in this forum's context at least - is that either issues being discussed have to allow for rational conversation to take place or I have no particular inclination to participate in that discussion.

The first possibility means replies which are literally or sound very close to "you are just as big a part of the problem as molesters" or "this makes me so mad!" are too ... charged to debate. It leaves very little room for actual reasonable dialogue to develop.

The second possibility simply seems like a lose/lose proposition. Who wins if we can't talk things like adults which might include the possibility of disagreeing - or even not agreeing across the board on every issue? Is that going to be better and, if so, for whom?

@Kanye-Qwest said in RL Anger:

I'd like to ask : how would you prefer these things be said?

"Some men are horrible people. Some people let them get away with it, thus proving to be pretty bad themselves."

@Kanye-Qwest I don't want to answer for Theno or anyone else, but it's a bit disconcerting to be tossed in with a very, very large group of people (in fact roughtly 50% of all humanity) like you share opinions, ideas or intentions and most importantly faults with 'them'.

We're not a hive mind, we just have a penis. In fact some claim it means we have less of a mind, not more.

The day a specific male is being misogynistic or a bigot call him on it. Otherwise it can get a bit offensive pretty quickly.