Best posts made by Lithium

That Last of Us 2 trailer is enough to make me pick up the first one I think.

Also, Soulcalibur 6, cannot, fucking, wait.

I've already said what system I am going to use.

I've already said where I would, and would not, set the game.

I'm /not/ going to force people to have a connection to other people who they don't even know, don't know if they're even compatible time wise, rp wise, or even /like/ each other OOCly or ICly.

People will come together and make ShadowRunning Teams /without/ staff involvement. There doesn't need to be /coded runs/ this is not a mud. It's not a moo. It's not a muck. It's a MUX. I'm most definitely not going to code up some automated run creation system where /1/ person could go on some simulated run all on their little lonesome.

If you want to go on Runs, then wait for someone to run one. Or run one for someone else. Or wait for staff to run one you can get involved in.

Be proactive and don't expect /anything/ to be fed to you on a silver spoon.

I am using ShadowRun 5th edition, modified for timeline and location.

The End.

EDIT: And if /anyone/ ever manages to hoard enough money they don't need to go on runs anymore? Congratulations! You've made it off the streets and out of the life. Not many runners get that far! You've done it! Throw a party! Retire the character since clearly they're not a runner anymore.

@apu I love the old games like that, rogue was so much fun, when you died your next play through you could run into your old characters ghost, no real graphics to speak of but imagination.

I would love a low magic fantasy setting, but, I'd prefer Conan over Game of Thrones...

GOG is doing a massive sale, like, being able to get both Vampire: The Masquerade games for a grand total of $5.89. The first game is a bit dated, the system is MET based, but it's still a pretty good game imho (even if I will never forgive them for taking my Cappadocian bae away).

Then of course there is Bloodlines, which is just frikken /awesome/.

Here we go again.

The more I see the same old crap over and over the more I want to shelve the whole thing.

I'm not going to automate runs.

I will explain why, for the last time:

Automation does not work when there is any objective other than 'kill this mobile npc'. That's all there is. Kill this object. Whether you are using combat skills, whether you are using social skills, magic, decking to kill mobile IC, whatever, all you're doing is rolling dice and playing with code.

It's not interactive.

There is no outside the box approach.

There is only combat pools.

Talk about boring!

Stop bringing it up in this thread, it's not on topic, it never will be, make your own god forsaken thread about trying to turna MUX into a MUD.

EDIT: Also, no matter HOW many lines of supposed 'poses' that I could try to automate, it'd still be repetition at it's worst. Oh look another random run, well we know what these npc's stats are! This will be a cake walk. Ok now this is going to happen next!

The greatest part about TableTop and about MU*'ing (to me) is /not knowing what is going to happen next/. Most video games don't have any real replayability without a billion billion lines of code. I am not coding ShadowRun version of Skyrim into a MUX. Just not happening. Quit asking for it.

Since it really belongs over here, one of the projects I am working on is a Mutants & Masterminds MUX, set in an original world. The general idea is that the city is frikken huge, not like Mega-City 1 from Judge Dread huge, but huge enough that it goes from horizon to horizon.

Because it's so big, there's so many people, that even thousands of heroes can't stop all the crime everywhere (I am taking that from Dread though) so there is always a need for heroes even though there's tons of them.

I want to have different areas of the grid be set up for different styles of play, some will be grit and gritty for vigilante type characters where it's messy and bloody, some will be more akin to four color good guys vs bad, some will be in between. This way there is a wide variety of areas for people to play in and a wide variety of acceptable characters.

Starting characters will be of two varieties, standard Power Level 10 characters will require an approval before play, while anyone can make a quicky character that is PL 5. PL 5 characters are more 'High School' or 'Side Kick' type of characters, or just someone very very new to their abilities. PL 5 characters won't require an approval, just go through the chargen and if they finish to the code's satisfaction, they can play immediately.

Obviously I can't run it all by myself, and there is some huge gaps in themes, so when I am ready I am going to look for other staffers but until then, that's the general idea.

I went with Mutants & Masterminds because the system is fast and simple and generally should be pretty smooth for combat scenes I am hoping without to much chart checking, and chargen is a breeze compared to, say, Hero System.

@Cirno said:

@Lithium said:

I have enough time to run something again the hobby might no longer really exist.

• It's going to take you 40 years to have time for this again?

or

• The hobby still 'really exists'?

Pick one.

I don't have to pick one. In 40 years I will be dead because unlike you, I am not some young kid who thinks he knows everything. At the rate the hobby is losing people and not gaining many, raw attrition says that it won't be /that/ much longer in the grand scope of things that there won't be truly sustainable numbers for anything other than pay to play muds and sex MU*'s. Cuz Sex always sells.

EDIT: As to why we are losing and not gaining? Kids these days grew up with exceptional graphics video games. Most do not have the inclination to really learn to use their imagination when someone else can do it for them and put it on the television through the power of a console or even the PC. There are huge worlds for them to learn and love and they don't need to learn to stretch themselves now because giving someone a 'living' fantasy world through games has become such a huge business and technology has progressed to the point that most don't need to use their imagination to picture the game world, or even know how to tell good literature from bad (Yes, I am looking at you Twilight fans).

So text on a screen? It is to slow, they have to read, they have to wait for any 'gratification'. MUD's are slightly better off because they are at least faster paced, create character, go kill mobs, loot rewards, rinse and repeat.

As someone who's been MU*'ing nearly as long as @Cirno has been alive (If they are really 25 years old) I can honestly say the heyday is WELL passed. When even a HORRIBLE (imho) game like Dark Metal had hundreds of people, and if your game ever had less than 20 on it was /dying/ or already dead, that we've lost a LOT of fellow hobbyists.

Now the rare (non-sex) game breaks 50 people at peak time, and it's not for lack of variety. So yeah, the community is dwindling.

I don't agree with @Arkandel in this whole thing to begin with. I think if we all could play together nicely, we would have done it by now. People become to invested, unwilling to back down, unwilling to compromise, and /that/ is why there needs to be rules.

Society has laws, not necessarily because they are good, but because they provide boundaries of what is acceptable, and what is not. Without those boundaries things quickly devolve into Lord of the Flies type situations.

Humans are cruel, we are vicious, we are wicked, and we care about ourselves more than others when taken as a whole. There are outliers, but really, Human Nature is pretty much the same as wild beasts (Look at Otters and Sea Lion pups, Sea Lions and Penguins, Dolphins, Killer Whales, etc).

Civilization, Society, all rules we have put into place to try and stem the tide of destruction that happens when humans meet other humans.

It doesn't work that well given the amount of murder and worse that is ongoing even today.

So why would anyone think this would be a utopia in a mush format? I have no idea. It's like a big hands of sign by the staff saying 'Do what you will.' and eventually people will be asshats enough that Staff will have to place down rules, they'll have to enforce them, and it'll end up just like every other mu* with enforced rules and staff interactions...

@Ghost

I like them both for what they are. I find both entertaining, one in a more actiony way and the other in a much more cerebral way. Both are entertaining and worth watching for different reasons.

Big ship Firefly does sound somewhat intriguing though.

@Arkandel said:

It's rare to see it as a Storyteller. I bring in NPCs the characters have every reason to fear but they don't show it. They'll give lip, stand defiant, try to negotiate... but they won't ever lose their composure, back down or be intimidated. Sometimes I'd like that as well, to see the hopelessness sink in. Everyone conquers their fears, it seems.

This is actually one of the /only/ things I truly love about the FATE system. Social Combat can be just as horrible as physical combat, up to and including some serious complications and consequences.

Is it perfect? No, but the social character can be /deadly/.

EDIT: Side note - This is why Super Hero games need to be more popular, so many people just want to play unrealistic super heroes who think they'll survive anything even if they don't run and hide when guns come out, they'd /better/ be a frikken super hero.

Not in my world though, nobody is immortal in my games. People will die. There are no kid gloves and no PC or NPC is sacred.

I don't think most people on MU*'s actually know what a healthy D/s relationship is. They think Fifty Shades of Grey is something other than creepyfuckstalker abuse because that's what they think D/s is supposed to be like.

As for why more people might proclaim to be sub more than dom, it's because people are lazy and they can't be assed to come up with stuff themselves, and they don't understand that it's the sub who truly controls how far things go and instead just want masturbatory RP.

Which is fine I guess, not my cup of tea, but as long as they're not actually hurting anyone...

This is kind of a derail but I am really interested in using a system for my super game where I can fully automate all XP spending, which is one reason why I haven't settled on one yet. I've discovered that other than pure wealth economy systems like Dungeons & Dragons, nebulous money statistics (Resources from White Wolf, Fate, even Hero System) are a real pain in the ass. In very little time someone could go from broke to wealthiest person on the planet type stuff... it is an issue.

Back on topic:

I think with anime themed games the world itself has to be huge, and more expansive than just the player characters. I would think a world like Full Metal Alchemist would work, because the main characters are cool but hardly the most only alchemists on the planet. There are a lot of problems that can be used on the grid and it allows for a wide variety of game play as a setting.

Something like Knights of Sidonia... not so much.

I've done it in TT, when my dice were on fire and I kept rolling nat 20's, well, I didn't feel like total PK'ing the party that night and so some crit hits became misses. I think there requires some trust in the group with the DM/ST/GM in order to create a good story.

On a MU* though, I fudge /nothing/. All rolls are out in the open because I cannot allow any sort of favoritism to be present. I can't pull my punches in one situation and not the next because it's not the same environment and you never know when you're going to get the same collection of individuals again, even if it's for a continuation plot/session.

On a MU* I believe it should be by the rules, whatever those rules are.

I even put in code so that people can set their own verification code for dice rolls so that people can't spoof rolls as the verification would be wrong and people would know without having to be set nospoof.

The reason I feel that way is because it is the /only/ way to be fair to everyone, as impartial as possible. If the rules say something, then that's what it /is/. Period. Otherwise you cannot guarantee anything remotely resembling fairness to every player.

@faraday said:

@Lithium said:

I've done it in TT, when my dice were on fire and I kept rolling nat 20's, well, I didn't feel like total PK'ing the party that night and so some crit hits became misses. I think there requires some trust in the group with the DM/ST/GM in order to create a good story.

But why is that so different in a MUSH environment? Don't you want your MU players to have the same opportunities for fun and a good story as your tabletop ones in that scenario?

Sure you can say you wouldn't have exactly that same mix of people together, but so what? As long as your mission is always "help players tell a good story" and you apply that mission fairly to everyone (and not, say, just to your buddies), isn't that fair enough?

Because as soon as you play favorites one way, it will bite you on the ass eventually once drama hits. Around a gaming table drama is less an issue, people will just say: Shut up Diana, or Bob, or whatever and the game will move on. In a MU* it's a whole different environment. How many times have we seen systems that work great in table-top not work so well in a MU* environment? It's the same type of thing, it's a different environment so we need some different practices.

Here is my worry, and why I will not fudge in a MU*.

I am running a scene, the BSD are kicking the Gaian's asses through no fault of their own. I fudge dice rolls, and the Gaians win, yay everyone celebrates. No harm done, or so it seems

Then a few weeks later I am running another scene, and someone is outright /stupid/ and I decide that their stupidity needs to be rewarded with an appropriate response. The dice say their stupidity gets them punished, so I don't fudge the dice and the person gets hurt, possibly killed, maimed, renown loss, whatever.

Person of questionable intelligence hears about (or partook) in the scene where I fudged the dice for someone else. Instantly cries of favoritism abound, much drama ensues, and it's just a mess that is completely and utterly avoidable.

If the dice say a group is losing, well, maybe they should be smart enough to know when to cut their losses and retreat. Sometimes a loss even makes for good story, much better than the PC's always win no matter what.

The context and environment are completely different in tabletop than in a MU. The sample size is smaller (in general) and staff have a /duty/ to be fair to everyone equally. Which means the code/dice tell the story, once it comes to dice.

@mietze Exactly. A good RP'er engages the scene and interacts enough to keep the scene flowing. It doesn't have to be a six line pose to do that. Sometimes a nod is just a nod, but you can always do /more/ than nod to keep the scene flowing. You don't have to fill it with 6 lines of telepathic prose that people can't even know because it's inside their characters head, or whatever.

Eclipse Phase was a neat environment and setting, but, the rules for it were clunky as all hell. Back when I first tried to start coding I jumped in /way/ over my head and tried to code an Eclipse Phase chargen... that was impossible for me at the time.

The ideas behind it are very cool, but, it also is a game that needs personal narrative driving things forwards so the scale as huge as it is, needs to be smaller in order to make sense.

The other problem is the environments, sure you could ego cast yourself with forks or whatever but what kind of setting do you use? A station? A hab cluster with it's own rules? Space travel in the system is slow as heck to do it physically, and then there's the pandora gates, so it gets somewhat tricky to try and have a cohesive setting and theme that makese sense to a wide variety of concepts.

It's a lot easier to do like, all resistance fighters, all explorer's, all trouble shooters or whatever which makes sense for tabletop but falls apart at larger numbers.

As far as settings go, I love the RIFT's setting, but the system... damn you Siembieda... damn you for the Palladium system and all it's clunkyness.

@BigDaddyAmin Uhh... every game turns into a TS factory.

TRANSFORMERS turned into a TS Factory... I still don't get that one but it did.

@Chuma-Del-Tort I have clearly upset you somehow. I would suggest that you take your vitriol to a forum more deserving of it. Perhaps the Hog Pit? It's more than a little off topic here.

Have a nice day.

@faraday Here's the problem: Your character isn't the protagonist of the MU*.

It's not.

Neither is anyone else's.

People like to say that they're writing a story, and they are, but they aren't just writing their characters story. They're writing the /Story Of The Game/.

Where your character /fits/ in that story is really going to depend on who's reading it and their take on the story and situation at large.

There is no one single 'Protagonist' in a MU*, at least not on any one I've ever been to unless it was a super FC like Rand Al'Thor on a WoT game. There is no reason /not/ to kill off a character if the games story has lead to that event happening. It all further pushes the story further, what ripples occur because of that death? How does it impact other characters? How does it impact the power structure of the game? How does it alter the future of the game and further the /games/ story?

This is why the idea of immortal characters, that anyone is writing out the 'protagonist' story is a false assumption. Everyone can't be the protagonist. Even if you allow only one specific thing, like only Arthurian Knights, who is the Protagonist? Arthur, Galahad, Gawaine, Merlin, or Lancelot?

It just doesn't work, and when people realize that the games story isn't about /them/, then we can see some beautiful history take place as the game takes on a life of it's own that isn't full of consent abuse and drama llama's.

Just my opinion.

EDIT: This is what happens when I respond without reading the whole thread. Sorry to beat a semi-dead or dying horse.