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    Best posts made by Pyrephox

    • RE: Eldritch - A World of Darkness MUX

      @Three-Eyed-Crow said:

      People want to be INSTANT BESTIES or INSTANT TWU WUV or INSTANT EVERYTHING on a MUSH. There's no story there, but they want it anyway. It annoys me, and it makes these encounters with PCs who want to tell me their life story feel somehow more shallow, because there's nowhere we can really go from there.

      This is certainly one of my biggest issues in most games. I like the slow burn. I like my characters growing to trust, like, or love someone gradually from meaningful interactions in character! That's something that really, really does it for me. So when someone moves from 'we just met' to 'I LOVE YOU FOREVER' and there /isn't/ supernatural mind control involved, I'm a lot less interested (and actually kinda creeped out). Same, honestly, with friendship and trust. Here, I've just met you, so let me tell you everything about me (or give you a free room in my house, or offer to kill someone for you, or whatever), and it doesn't feel...real.

      For whatever definition of "real" applies to silly online games.

      posted in Adver-tis-ments
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Mismatched themes and expectations

      @arkandel I tend to think of thematic mismatch as an OOC problem, and therefore one that needs an OOC discussion as a solution. Using IC means to try and "correct" what is ultimately an OOC misunderstanding of the purpose of the game usually just breeds frustration and resentment on behalf of both GMs and players, and can particularly feel very disrespectful from a player's POV, where it can feel like the GM is just shitting over all your cool ideas for no reason you can see.

      posted in Game Development
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Eliminating social stats

      I'm well known to be on the side of a mechanized social conflict system, and for that system to be rigorously used and enforced throughout the game.

      However, that said - if you wanted a political game without social stats, I would suggest instead leveraging resource stats. While you are eliminating the potential for a wider variety of players to play a robust series of concepts (if only highly socially competent players can play highly socially competent characters and be effective while having fun, it will reduce the overall variety of character concepts in your game, and skew the game towards combat competent characters), if you're fine with that as an opportunity cost, that's up to you. But you could attempt to compensate for that more by leaning more heavily on resources - money, land, military might, rare economic goods, and by creating specific systems that moderate the ability to trade and cash in these resources. This allows people to do the 'wheeling and dealing' aspect of politics without actually being good at sweet-talking others - you may not be able to craft a persuasive pose to save your life, but you can probably type "Count Rudolfo has 80 acres and a mule that he'll trade Duchess Tupelo, if she will make the bandits on the southern border go away". Design the domains to be diverse enough that everyone needs something from everyone, and make war risky enough that tromping over and just rolling combat dice isn't enough to steal all other people's shit, and at least some level of political play will emerge.

      If someone does retain individual social skills/conflict resolution, I've become increasingly fond of incentivizing losing. Yes, if your character loses a social conflict, they have to do something that might not be in their best interest. But if you the PLAYER receive a reward for going along with that (or committing fully to it), then you have a reason to suck it up. Also, perhaps setting a hierarchy of success and what actions can be compelled. For a political game, you likely don't want huge swings in attitude to be compelled from social skills, because you want to maximize negotiation and intrigue space. At the same time, you don't want social characters to feel like they have to 'grind' someone's attitude IC. So what you might do, now that I'm thinking about it, is have social change/combat be sort of an unholy hybrid of 7th Sea 2E's story system, and CoD's Doors.

      Social Character has to declare to the GM a meaningful end goal. This social system would not be useful for 'I want you to sleep with me' or other micro interactions (including fast talking one's way past a door guard, etc.) but would instead focus on larger, political play. So, say, the goal might be "I want the Empress to take her travelling court to a specific lady's landholdings, because I'm repaying a favor that lady did for me, and the Empress always awards a boon to her host."

      The GM would then say, "Okay - that's not a particularly risky undertaking, so you'll have to do three tasks successfully to get the Empress to agree. The Empress is a PC, so let's rope her in. Hey, Empress-Player, what are three challenges that PC A would have to overcome to get Empress Tidypants to take her travelling court to Baronness Murzi's lands for the next season?"

      Empress-Player might say, "Well, no one's requested it yet, so she's got no reason to fight the idea. First, PC A would have to have a good pitch (a scene with Charisma + Persuasion as a roll, maybe). Oh, and Tidypants loves to stay places with luxuries, so she'd have to know that she's going to be taken care of, if you know what I mean (Bribery, throwing her a party showcasing the exotic goods of Murzi-land, or a successful Intelligence + Fashion roll during a second scene might all be options here). Oh, and Empress Tidypants would need to feel safe moving her court, of course (so maybe an Intelligence + Leadership roll, or lending troops, or hiring mercenaries to protect her, could be a resolution of this)."

      PC A might say, "That sounds reasonable," or they might say it's not worth it, or if one of the requirements seems excessive, the GM might step in and say, hey, "Hey, requiring that PC A arranges for the death of a rival's kid in exchange for this seems a bit excessive. How about he humiliates the rival at a public scene, instead?" To reduce GM load, you could also build in character types for players who enjoy doing this sort of balancing - a Negotiator's Order, or something, and helping people design these social maps would be one of their jobs.

      But what about conflict and failure? You'd have to restrict it somehow. Perhaps you only get as many chances as you have some level of the Key Social Skill. So, like, if it's a 1-10 scale on skills in the example above, and the GM decides the Key Skill is Persuasion, and PC has 5 Persuasion, then they get 5 attempts to get those three things. If they fail, say, to make the Empress feel safe the first time, but got everything else, then they get two shots to make up for that, perhaps at a difficulty increase. If they don't get it by the end of the next two attempts? The Empress is unmoved - and keeps the bribes, of course.

      Likewise, under this system, you're less likely to run into direct PC vs. PC conflict, and more into colliding gambits and plots. Which could be a plus, in a political game. I would generally say first past the post - if two people are competing for a similar goal, then the first person to achieve their goals wins. However, you also might work out a success exchange - perhaps people could take their successful scenes, and instead of applying that towards their end goal, they could instead use it to counter a success someone else has achieved towards their goal. Perhaps with some level of investigation/intrigue system so that characters can discover each other's plots and plans.

      It would be a very different way of thinking of social conflict resolution, but one which might suit the slower, more narrative style of MU*s better than the "roll and resolve" system that is used in physical conflict.

      posted in Mildly Constructive
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: The Apology Thread

      @Lisse24 said in The Apology Thread:

      @Arkandel said in The Apology Thread:

      But although that kind of friendship is important I will return what I'm given, too. If I suggest playing together a few times and you decline but don't reciprocate later on I'll take the hint and not ask again. No harm done or insult taken but I'll share my time online with people who like spending theirs hanging out with me. I think that's fair.

      This should be embossed in gold and hung over the door. It's my basic philosophy. I'm an easy-going person. I'll spend time with anyone ... as long as I think they want to spend time with me, too. In game, that means if I'm constantly bugging you for a scene, and you never seem to be up for it? Well, eventually you're going to be on my list of people to not-bug. If I page and chat and you're all standoffy? I won't page anymore.

      Same here. Typically, I will ask three times. If, on the third time, I am turned down for whatever reason, my general response is that they can let me know if they ever want to play/are available, and then I figure my work is done. If they want to RP, they can let me know, but I'm not going to chase after them. Frustrating thing, though, is when someone pages ME wanting RP, and I say sure, here are the times I'm available, what works? and then they say, uhhhh, I don't know. I'll say, well, you know when I'm on, so give me a wave when you want to play, and then they never contact me again.

      posted in A Shout in the Dark
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Original Sci-Fi?

      I would really love to see a SF exploration/adventure game set on an alien world with a crashed colony ship. New characters could be thawed out colonists, a meta plot could be discovering ruins, native species, maybe a conspiracy that crashed the ship, but it could also just have a lot of awesome crazy world building and adventure plots.

      posted in MU Questions & Requests
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Development Thread: Sacred Seed

      @cobaltasaurus Ooh, very cool!

      • What are the major guiding values of the culture(s) that are playable? Like, is the concept of good stewardship /super/ important, since so much of the culture revolves around the idea of this sacred agricultural product?
      • What playstyles are supported (i.e., political, chef-crafting, intrigue, adventure, direct CvC (personal and direct organizational conflict), indirect CvC (by means of competing for limited resources or boons))?
      • What characters does the game explicitly not support? (Not just things like rape, but also, like, I think you've mentioned Gardeners aren't PC-playable, so things like that.)
      • In broad strokes, how do people of this land Not Think Like modern American folk? Not in every little detail, but just if there are any major ways in which they significantly diverge, such as an expectation that an adult isn't an adult until they've done some specific ritual, or that there's a certain class of people who are untouchable, etc. (And what consequences can characters expect if their players decide that they will stand in opposition to these cultural mores - is it more of a 'the NPCs roll their eyes and gossip' or something stronger?)
      • What are the absolute coolest things about this setting/theme in staff's eyes, and how do they see PCs interacting with those things from the start?
      • Finally, what does staff think are some of the character types who are going to be able to jump in and get involved the /easiest/, especially if you're a brand new player and just starting to read up on theme?
      posted in Game Development
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Eliminating social stats

      @WTFE said in Eliminating social stats:

      @Lithium said in Eliminating social stats:

      Without bad things, there is no conflict, without conflict there is no drama, there is only bar RP and TS.

      I think this may be the very first time I've heard a call for MORE drama on a MU*...

      There is good drama, and bad drama! Many MU*s could use more good drama.

      posted in Mildly Constructive
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: How would you format a log for publishing?

      @faraday is right - MU* logs make /really bad/ stories, much like transcripts of tabletop games do. (And yes, livestreaming has some success, but largely on the strength of the charisma and charm of the players and GMs.) The rhythm, pacing, and characterization is all wrong, you have different writing styles mixed up, the plots beats don't tend to follow a clear narrative arc...it's very bad fiction. It's a lot of fun as improv, but it's not good fiction.

      posted in Game Development
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Eliminating social stats

      @WTFE Synnibarr doesn't count! Nor does FATAL - we have to have some standards.

      Traveler is its own thing. And yeah, dying in chargen is silly - but just like the Tomb of Elemental Evil, sometimes you're in the mood for something ridiculously hardcore. I know some people who really enjoy that kind of thing.

      posted in Mildly Constructive
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Gamecrafting: Excelsior

      @bear_necessities said in Gamecrafting: Excelsior:

      One thing I would suggest is to make sure there's a low barrier to entry in any of the systems you implement. I.E. I wouldn't set the EP requirements to 50 right out the gate; I'd maybe set it to 25 and see how quickly players accumulate EP and if there's enough buy-in and excitement to get to that point.

      I'd also have some good documentation in the Sector about the initial look of the room. If Staff creates the description after the EP points accumulate and the job is inputted, how am I supposed to RP and create plot in the sector without knowing what the environment looks like, etc?

      I've noticed that players get REALLY EXCITED about the idea of exploring and building stuff, but there's not a lot of follow-through. I would have some back-up plans in the event that the exploration system really doesn't wind up being something that players are utilizing.

      Yeah, to all of these. I'd actually like to have a bit of a beta period pre-game to really test things out. Probably with a test sector that wouldn't be used in the actual game, and pre-made test characters. Which isn't to say there wouldn't be tweaking to all of the systems, but ideally I'd like to have chance to run through some time where people just try to break it without having to worry about repercussions for other players, then fix, then wipe and reboot.

      And what I'm thinking for the sector descs is actually kind of unusual, in that they'll be more like mini-reports with a brief, broad desc at the bottom. Like the sensor report the characters would be receiving from the ship. Considering how Ares puts the room desc at the top of the log if you set the location, I think that'd go well with it. A VERY off-the-cuff example might be:

      ===================================
      Designated Colonization Territory: Sector 1
      Mineral Deposits: Very Rich
      Flora and Fauna: Scarce
      Terrain: Dangerous
      Atmosphere: Moderately Toxic, High Temperature

      The land currently known as "Sector 1" is a broad swath of seismically active volcanic canyons which reach from mountains to a black sea, covering approximately 80 miles of territory. The ground and air are obscured by a thin haze of black ash that sears the lungs. Jagged cracks in the earth lead to 'rivers' of lava which flow into an ocean whose floor is rippled, black obsidian. The canyons are riddled with caves where subterranean fauna and various types of sulfur-loving fungus have been remotely observed. The occasional geyser erupts at irregular intervals from yellowed, crusted pools. Temperature and breathing regulators strongly advised.

      ==================================

      So, very broad, but still with enough 'hooks' (I hope) to draw people in and give them inspiration of what to play there. And there will be one Sector which will have several grid rooms pre-developed. Both to give people some examples of what you can do with the system (I'll include how much EP each one would be if it were built through the system, and why), as well as being immediate places to play for players who aren't as interested in the system, or who struggle to come up with ideas, but still want to get their 'alien wilderness explorer' on.

      My hope is that by providing clear systems and examples it can overcome some of players' choice paralysis when it comes to "what do I do next". Ideally, I'd like it to be a very low stress way to try out running a scene here and there while also having something that people can contribute to the game in a concrete way. Sort of leaving your mark on the world. I feel like that captures the idea of exploration in a meta-way that I enjoy.

      posted in Game Development
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: How should IC discrimination be handled?

      Okay, so here is where people are getting confused about whether you're advocating for all -isms to never be brought up in games:

      @collective said in How should IC discrimination be handled?:

      Here's the thing: Why is it hurtful to suggest that it's hurtful to use that kind of language and bring those situations into play? Why is calling a gay player's gay character a fag okay, but saying 'I have to wonder why you want the right to call somebody a fag' not okay?

      Because right there? It looks an /awful/ lot like you're doing just that, and suggesting that the players themselves are hurting other players by wanting to play a fictional character who may express certain real world bigotries.

      Also, I think it's time that we consider the other side of it, as well, in that every player is (probably) an adult who is presumably capable of making their own decisions, and not being forced to log into any particular game. Which means, really, that if you as a person are deeply wounded by a fictional character using a slur, then there's some responsibility to curate your own experiences, and either making it clear OOC that you're not interested in that sort of play experience, or choosing to not join, or to leave, games with settings that allow that.

      I like Arx; it's a second world fantasy game that has chosen to make a very egalitarian society, and that's a lot of fun to play. But if Arx was a game set in Meiji-era Japan, even Meiji-era Japan with magic, then I would want and expect to see some level of the cultural inequalities that existed then as play elements. If someone played a burakumin, then I'd damned well expect to see them struggle with ostracism and bigotry (within reason that allowed them to still participate in the game) and the changing nature of their social status, and if I were playing someone who wasn't a member of that caste or defined by being 'progressive', I would absolutely portray my character having those bigoted stances, even though it's remotely possible that someone else on the game OOCly could be a member of that society. Because that's the setting of the game, and it's an interesting conflict. I wouldn't make it 'the defining trait' of my character, because outside of certain media, bigotry rarely IS the defining trait of someone's character - it's a distressing and unsightly extra, like a prominent, hairy mole that draws your eye to it at the worst possible times.

      And it's fun to play characters who have a couple of those, especially when they tie directly into making a setting not just like the everyday world, and a character not just you in funny dress.

      posted in Mildly Constructive
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Silent Heaven: Small-Town Psychological Horror RPG

      @carma Thank you. And people can find self-reflection and meaning in all sorts of things, including gaming. I'd never deny that. But it's not a process that you're (probably) qualified to facilitate, and if something goes wrong - if something is too raw, or triggers self-harm impulses, you're not in a position to be able to intervene for someone's safety. So it's best not to get involved in that side of things as a game.

      But good luck with the game!

      posted in Game Development
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Code systems that make it easier to get on with the business of roleplaying

      A small but excellent one: pose/history on Arx. If your connection gets dropped, when you relog, all you have to do is hit +pose/history and you get the last few poses in the room since you posed. No one has to page you what you missed, or halt the scene to try to figure out what you did or didn't see. It is wonderful.

      posted in Mildly Constructive
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Silent Heaven: Small-Town Psychological Horror RPG

      I'm curious about the reasoning behind only allowing a consent check on one item once a day - a given scene or plot might logically include a number of things which could be no-go areas for someone, so it seems like it'd facilitate cooperation if people could just access or share their full lists so that they can more easily find people of compatible tastes and boundaries.

      posted in Game Development
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: The limits of IC/OOC responsibility

      @packrat said in The limits of IC/OOC responsibility:

      Give the example that @bored gave about Star Crusade earlier in the thread this is something I have been thinking about a lot for any new Fading Suns game, also keep in mind stuff that I observed on Arx.

      To start with I am looking at having a much flatter structure for feudal/whatever power holders. On Arx a baron gets pretty much the same ways to interact with the economy/systems as a duke but with smaller numbers, all dukes report to a head of house whilst having marquis level nobles reporting to them, etc. This is both not very interesting and pretty weird if trying to emulate any kind of actual feudal hierarchy and its snakepit messiness. Playing a duke I ran into a fair bit of griping from say, counts about how poor and unimportant they were, let alone barons. Anyone not a landed noble was basically not on the scale at all outside of the head of church guy, who was an NPC who then politically shot the faction in the head before being replaced.

      Although I like the ideas you've brought up, I'm going to quibble with this characterization - and that's speaking as the player of the PC who was one of the ones leading the charge to replace the NPC. The PCs playing the heads of the great houses mostly voted to commit human sacrifice, in an /extremely public setting/, and in return, the NPC excommunicated them, since the religion in question is unambigiously against human sacrifice. This wasn't 'shooting the faction in the head' it was IC actions leading to IC consequences. Did the NPC do it, in part, to further his own political ambitions? Absolutely. Was the human sacrificed justified? Most likely. But if the heads of several Catholic nations all got together and decided to sacrifice people to Satan on public TV, the Pope is gonna excommunicate them, no matter that they claim that the public sacrifice is necessary to avert the apocalypse.

      What actually led to the fantasy Pope being replaced was the possible murder of a High Lady, which never went to trial due to Sudden And Mysterious Disappearance.

      While it was a bit frustrating in the moment to have your head NPC seem to be determined to turn the entire PC population against you, once I sat back and thought about it, it led to fun RP and it reinforced the theme and the consequences that SHOULD be involved in things like...publicly deciding to sacrifice human beings because of magical things no one outside the PCs actually believe in.

      Which is, coming back to the topic, also a part of leadership play that NPCs are better for than PCs. It /sucks/ to be the PC everyone loves to hate because you're having your character enforce the less cuddly parts of theme, or telling someone that no, your character is never going to approve of what they see as an insult to the org they're leading, no matter /how/ popular the character (or player) doing the insult is. NPCs don't necessarily need to give a crap about the fact that PCs are always going to interpret things through a very 'PCs are the center of the world and the exception to every rule' lens. (And I'm even in /favor/ of that lens, within reason.)

      posted in Mildly Constructive
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Silent Heaven: Small-Town Psychological Horror RPG

      I'll say that I appreciate you laying out exactly what the non 'optional' things in the game are, and wish more games would do that so that people can self-select in or out with full information.

      Also, it looks like you've done a LOT of work on this game, and with a heavily coded game, that's difficult to follow through on. Great work!

      posted in Game Development
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Coming Soon: Arx, After the Reckoning

      I would say the system doesn't need to prevent absolutely people 'falling in' to situations outside their comfort zone and managing to succeed - but that should be an outside odds proposition. And, unfortunately, there is a significant disconnect between 'high-stakes' combat situations and 'high-stakes' social situations that badly penalizes social characters entering the first over combat characters entering the latter: character loss.

      There are very, /very/ few social situations that are played out IC which have character loss as a potential outcome for performing badly. However, there are a lot of combat situations which have that outcome - and more, there are coded objects which benefit people who focus on combat (weapons and armor), so the difficulty levels in those situations tend to get pushed ever higher, making it even less likely for non-combat characters to be able to achieve anything meaningful in exchange for the risk. If there were a failure mode for high-stakes social situations that was equivalent, you'd find people self-selecting pretty quickly.

      And there is, in a court-based society. Temporary exile was pretty commonly used to indicate someone who had just offended the ruler of a court completely, or made themselves socially unmentionable. But the howls of outrage for implementing such a thing would be heard from orbit, despite it still being more gentle than losing one's character forever.

      posted in Mildly Constructive
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Travel Times - Enforced?

      I want some sort of acknowledgement of travel times involved that cuts down on the teleportation issue (unless you actually have teleporters), but I don't know that it needs to be isolation in a grid room. These days, I'm more leaning towards some sort of off-screen time resource that can be spent to do off-screen actions, /including/ travel time. So you still have to commit to a journey, but rather than being cut off from RP at your origin or destination, you can transfer when you want, and just pay the 'travel cost' out of resources. Keeps people from trivializing travel, but also keeps them from being stuck in a room, possibly by themselves, for significant amounts of our precious, precious gaming time.

      posted in Mildly Constructive
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Let's talk about TS.

      @mietze said in Let's talk about TS.:

      I dunno. But it seems to me the biggest problem people are always complaining about their RP partners to their other ones. It's pretty fun when the "spokes" of the wheel finally talk and realize what a shit the "hub" is being. I've made some of the best mush friends that way. 😄

      It usually seems to be a way of manipulating play partners to a) stay away from each other, and b) be flattered by the praise (and therefore spend more of their RP time with the manipulator).

      posted in Mildly Constructive
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      Pyrephox
    • RE: Getting Involved (and getting other people involved)

      @Rook said:

      Hye, @Pyrephox... you RP with some weird, unbalanced, fucking strange people who don't understand cooperative role-play in a realistic environment.

      That needs to be an acronym.... or something.

      I do play on MU*s, yes.

      posted in Mildly Constructive
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      Pyrephox
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