Are you for real? Yes. That is exactly what I was saying, because I was snarking at you over refusal to acknowledge that 'let's try it this way' and 'you are doing it wrong' are two different statements. There IS a huge difference, and if you genuinely think that there is not, you fail at social interaction and would obviously need to go with not having to RP stuff out. I was calling you an idiot.
No. The only reason they're leading to that conclusion is because you refuse to acknowledge they could be interpreted any other possible way. Your premise (that X leads to Y, and therefore Z is true) is incorrect, because it is only for you that X must lead to Y. This is where 'personal' comes in for personal preference.
No, what I have insisted is different is 'if you aren't playing my way you're wrong' and 'I'd like to try doing it this way'. Because they are. You rolled in from the start talking about people being terrible for the thought of taking social skills out of a system and attributing all sorts of motivations to them. It's what I objected to in the very first place. Just because you don't think someone's reasons are GOOD ENOUGH it does not actually mean they are doing it for reasons beyond the ones they're giving. You don't have to agree, but to refuse to acknowledge it's personal preference and not The One True Way IS most certainly screaming WRONGFUN! WRONGFUN!
ETA: And just so we're perfectly clear, I don't actually think I'd ever play a game that took all social skills out in the first place. It doesn't sound fun to me to not have them. But I'm capable of acknowledging that it's my preference and not some universal truth.
How can you say
@Lain said in Eliminating social stats:
Sure, but nobody is arguing that certain playstyles are wrong except those who write off social stats mattering as "rollplaying."
And then immediately turn around and say this:
So in conclusion, it's not about autonomy, it's not about believability, it's not about immersion, and it's not about suspension of disbelief, it's about "my character is above the bullshit, just like me!"
It is this mentality, specifically, that I am addressing. That just because you don't understand why someone might have a different preference than you, they MUST have this particular motivation.
Anyone who doesn't see a difference between 'if you play this way you are wrong' and 'I would like to try and play like this' has a problem.
@Lain said in Eliminating social stats:
@Sunny said in Eliminating social stats:
This is a great example of 'if you don't do it the way that I do it, you've got bad motivations/are a bad player' when it's actually personal preference.
No more than people insisting that if you are bad with people IRL then by extension so must your character. If "it's just personal preference" can justify abolishing social but not mental skills, then logically, the inverse can also be true. I'm in favor of neither, mind you.
There's a huge, very significant difference, actually. I can see why you would be in favor of rollplay instead of roleplay where it comes to social skills, if you seriously equate these things out to the same sort of thing. Apples and rocks.
@Lain said in Eliminating social stats:
@faraday So if you can suspend disbelief for factual inaccuracy, why not for low interpersonal skill? I think it really does come down to not wanting to have it rubbed in your face that your character is not "above the bullshit." So even though people fall for obvious lies both in real life and in fiction all the time, if a player's bullshit detector goes off, then there's this illusion that it must also go off for the character in order to maintain suspension of disbelief.
I'd go as far as to call it an IC/OOC conflation to the extent that it indicates a floundering theory of mind in the person doing the RP. I wouldn't mind spending a ton of my IC points on things like Resolve/Composure in the interest of making my character actually "above the bullshit."
This is a great example of 'if you don't do it the way that I do it, you've got bad motivations/are a bad player' when it's actually personal preference.
I cannot imagine playing tabletop with people like that. I'd do it once with that group and NEVER AGAIN. It sounds terrible and miserable.
It is the only place you will likely ever find one. Or maybe Goodwill.
I have a similar story, save it was my grandfather's and it was not only a naked woman, it was a framed naked woman FUZZY painting. Like the black parts of it and the background was made of the same stuff the old marker posters were made of. I think it's felt but it may not be, I don't know. I had it for many years, until my brother in law's friend (he was helping me move) saw it and thought it was the greatest thing in the history of things. So it's in his garage now getting the love and respect it deserves.
@Jennkryst It's also why we shouldn't do it any more in the first place, because those are stupid hassles to enforce. I don't have time to RP in two hours, I have to go to bed. If I can't RP -- actually rp, not halfass 'work around' stuff -- I'm going to go find something else to do.
Edited to add: Why bake a problem into your game that people are going to have to tapdance to get around, that you have to build tools to get around? Maybe, I don't know, don't have the problem in the first place? Easier for everybody.
I am making business cards for Burt Macklin (Fully Bonded & Insured) right now for a work project.
Yeah, back in the days of yore when I could actually manage more than a single beer, I met people all the time at bars. Couple of places around here, that's like the whole point (and I'm not talking meat markets, either). It's like the whole point of going out solo? To make new friends? Shuffleboard or Air Hockey or w/e. I have met some awesome people that way.
Then I got old and shy.
Yeah, I agree. Code combat teaches Python, and the Stanford class doesn't teach a real language, but instead the concepts of coding.
Also
https://see.stanford.edu/Course/CS106A
It will not teach you mush code, but the Stanford class (it's free) should get the concepts across enough for you to teach yourself the mush stuff using helpfiles, dissecting other peoples' code, and asking for the occasional bit of help. Very few of the mush coders I know are anything but mostly self-taught.
Fuck her. I am so sorry, people are terrible.
My sister put a shirt on her cat, then was genuinely offended when I said she was weird for it. I can't decide which part makes me more crazy.
I got permission from Michelle West to do a Sun Sword game. Every time I sit down and start to contemplate it though, the amount of work involved makes my head hurt. Trying to somehow capture enough to get the feel without overwhelming people with unnecessary details...oh man.
That has to hurt a lot.