Best posts made by Lotherio

@A-B said in Tips for not wearing out your welcome:

I was not asked to leave, I was thrown out without warning. If you'd told me you wanted me to stop blethering, I could have stopped blethering.

This right here. You keep repeating this part that comes off angry. Everyone has answered. You are not owed an explanation. They gave one here. It is time for you to move on from this topic. You're getting answers just not the ones that work for your logic.

I work as an interventionist irl, this is the same thing I say to my high functioning Asperger's teens. Just because it's not the answer you're looking for doesn't mean it wasn't an answer. You just disagree and nothing wrong with disagreeing but there is a time to let it go. Good luck finding another game.

@Derp said in Personal Agency for Personal Boundaries:

You don't actually read a single thing I write, do you?

The problem as presented says people are open to be abused, how can we help them, what systems can we use. And you're saying, any system you implement can be abused, lets not do anything.

From the standpoint of rhetorical argument, you're not contributing to the discussion constructively. It can all be abused, we've established this. How do we address the former if the latter is not a solution? And if you don't think the former is a problem, start another thread, this feels like derailing.

@Ghost said in Real World Peeves, Disgruntlement, and Irks.:

What? The pretty girl I like also enjoys X-Men comics? I will woo her by testing her width of knowledge and then proving to her that I'm more of a superfan! She will be overcome by sexual attraction to my dominance that SHE WILL BE MIIIINE.

As this is the Real World Peeve thread and a lot of fellow fans/nerds/etc. do this among their friends, in the middle of movies ... a PSA, please stop. We don't care if the dagger Clint Barton used when his arrows ran out was from issue 12 of secret avengers which foreshadows that Ronin, the original owner of the dagger, would be involved and you're predicted this will relate to Kree/Skrull stuff in later movies. Honestly, whether a fellow nerdist knew what you're poining out or not, or the person next to you is a new fan to the movie-verses, we don't need to listen to you talking over five minutes of movie time to impress your friends or some girl or boy or whatever you think you're impressing.

My daughter is old enough to enjoy easter eggs and surprises and then asks for confirmation on what she sees sometimes but I remind her to ask after the movie - and we'll gladly talk about it after the movie over a burger or ice cream or something. She's learning not to talk about this stuff during movies, you the adult should know this by now too.

@kalakh said in Something Completely Different:

You broke the community trust. There's an unspoken understanding in any community of people, anywhere, in any medium, but particularly online, that those who hold the authority will use their authority fairly, that they will listen to complaints and concerns, and that they will take appropriate action. This does not mean bowing to every whim or allowing every fire to burn uncontrolled - and you are well aware of that - but it does mean that when a bunch of people have a problem with something you've done or not done, your response needs to measured, your response needs to come from a certain understanding of why the problem has sprung up, and it needs to adequately address the issue.

The trust was broken in a seeming majority of the vocal, not the majority at large. The bowing to every whim is the most accurate thing in here and frankly a lot of that bowing has gone to the vocal majority in the past 3-4 years, including allowance of skirting the letter of the ‘law’. Again, call me ignorant, but this continued pressure by a select group that has been a vocal majority has the perception of bullying; and I understand they don't want to hear that term when its applied to them as they like to believe they have the moral high ground. It reads as if, we got some changes here to make MSB better, we should have some control over what's allowed/disallowed from our viewpoint. From outside that viewpoint it looks a lot different. I'm not friends with Mods here, but I can see that being the perception while trying to point out this as a third party. I can be a scape goat/flying monkey/sympathizer if that makes folks feel better in some need to polarize sides here.

Cold rules-pounding does none of this. I think you fell back on it because you were unprepared for protest, you did not know how to respond to the size of said protest, the vehemence of it, the direct attacks and the anger, because iron-clad rules are comfortable for you, because you feel you can draw a line in the sand and everyone worthy will find where you draw the line to be acceptable, or at least satisfactory in the moment, and everyone unworthy can be kicked out without guilt, because breaking rules and crossing lines are in and of themselves proof that someone who receives a ban deserves the ban.

The having rules and sticking by it, including what to do about direct attacks and anger, was ironically advocated by the a large portion of the folks recently banned or having just walked. The irony is there. When this change came into being, a few years after the switch to this incarnation of MSB/WORA/Predecessors (or the one that wasn't hosted on digital ocean I suppose), some folks spoke up in anger, many older folks walked then not liking the change. A whole host of old faces walked then. They said MSB was dead as they walked out the door disgruntled. but it survived.. Then, which lead them to walk, there as a big advocacy for less silent observation by mods to more hands on administration. Just when it didn’t work, more recently, for the advocacy group, its now a bad thing - having some rules were good until it was applied to them. Again, I know I’m viewed as a flying monkey for admin, when I have zero contact with any of them.

A lot of people disagree.

A lot of people do not (I am not saying they agree either, but they are not upset over recent Mod activity) - they're just not largely vocal as the current posters have been in the last few years.

@devrex said in Review of Recent Bans:

Raw, cruel nastiness. Which. Cool. They have a spot for that now but equating “let’s stop the cyber bullying over here now” with what’s being said and has been said is an egregious false equivalency. And this whole group of folks once told me with straight faces they would gladly accept a ban from a game just so they could abuse Derp some more

I agree but I want to point out some of the conflicting thoughts on this. The 'whole group' does not equate with all those banned. From what I've seen @RightMeow is friends with (only from what I've seen, not saying they are or not) some of those banned that aren't in with the group in question. All the banned are not part of the same groups of friends so there is some confusion. That said, a lot of the virtue signaling that doubled as dog whistling, which came off as sometimes bullying to me, was joined in by a lot of various groups and other independent parties.

I agree though, if folks want the freedom of speech as a pretext to slander, start dumpster fires, and munch popcorn while seeing how funny (mean) someone can be, there is a forum for it. Its no longer here. There are multiple forums for it actually, prior bad actors here have started similar places for similar free speech.

ETA: The funny thing is while I've been openly attacked plenty in the history of this place, I've never had a personal (DM/PM) attack until I made the comment about what it looked like from a third party, which was pretty much an insult intended to say I'm not a third party.

Time for a Friday Update.

House tracking/sheets/trading/purchasing is up and running. Trades work, but its not a total system, there is no counter offers, bantering, etc. That is left to RP, the system is the end product to interactions between houses and house members on the grid; not a replacement for RP.

We’re delving into the heart of theme at present. Taking a closer look at Vindicti, the art of formalized vendetta for our game. A good quote from Encyclopedia Britannica, near the heart of day to day play; politics, alliances, vendetta.

These divisions [conflicts of nobility often along political lines of Guelf and Ghibelline] in fact largely reflected personal, economic, or quite local political rivalries—all inflamed by ideals of chivalric honor and an everyday acceptance of the traditions of vendetta.

It is highly more formalized for dramatics of play, named Vindicti. Vindicti is not unlike Kanly in Dune (based off a similar real world concept from the near east). We’re taking careful steps as we work this out for now. Our intent is not to make it simply some form to allow excuse of PK, to the point directly killing someone in another house is not honorable. Dueling is a highly accepted form of conflict, something like the final escalated conflict in Vindicti. For those not familiar with Pendragon, drawing swords is a little more than pretend fun time, even pulling blows for half damage, can be deadly and have lasting repercussions with a potential slim chance of dropping someone for good (armor/shield/hp dependent). Killing someone in a duel will come with investigation by the judiciary council to determine intent and recompense between houses. Not only does the offending house in a death have to pay the recompense, but the individual will suffer a tarnish which requires IC atonement; not some spiritual blessing, but the physical act of atonement whether to simply show publically, or for personal reasons to feel better, just that its a hit on reputation.

Other forms of conflict are more acceptable as well. Means of sabotage, social slander, even capture/ransom. Our goal is not coded systems for this, with statistics tracking behind the scenes, our focus is RP, we’re just giving more attention to Vindicti both in formal IC law and OOC policy/theme to assure its an RP tool only. This will most likely play into the idea of politics as discussed, such as the wooing of needed political NPCs for alliance and to sway votes/politics in Matora and abroad. Part of the sabotage could affect attempts to form/gain alliances or the attempts to gain favor/rep/info as well.

We will then further define the religious spectrum in the game which is reflective of the real world theme we are borrowing and altering. This was a big debate on Realms that we do not wish to get into, we’ll define more up front, from hierarchy on down. This will be a basis for religious groups, knighthoods and perhaps other groups with agendas that could be anti-religion (illuminati-esque). This is needed before we fully flush out neighbors in the city states from aristocratic cities that are probably supporting patrizio in our city in attempts to oust/remove nobility from their positions, or risen ventura (our condotieri), many also cavalieri/knights with no land holdings thanks to the numerous wars and entrada (crusades).

We will offer a number of houses, with heads open to app. Dependent on growth, we could open more but are going to offer group entrance/applicaiton to form new houses as needed as well. From the Conte level, which our opening houses start at, on down. While we will start play with an NPC at the level of Duca/Duchessa, the intent is not to keep it this way. This is an elected position and the intent is after play is established, to hold the next election for players to move into and rotate in this position to control the thrust of what our city does, leaving its success and failures in the hands of the players and the player houses.

The rest of the world will act, giving focus for the players to react to and, depending on player action, the world will react accordingly. Note that while it is very lightly fantasy and there could be some potential of real divinity of some sort, this is not a focus. There is no invading shadows or scary stuff coming, there are no end of the world/save the day/save the world plots. There is a socio-political focus on working together even while being enemies and rivals and making the overall success relevant to the city itself. Or, being enemies, removing enemies and changing the political landscape. We will offer challenges, dilemmas, hurdles and obstacles.

All said, we’re nearing that point of opening, knowing code may be added or altered to reflect need and want by the players, the basics are laid out to get there. Its is near, but I can’t say a time as that my jinx such a deadline, just we are getting closer.

Having risen in influence and power, the city of Matora is readily focused on its own affairs. The Great Houses of the city, with trade empires stretching to the corners of the world, have a greater interest in valor and vengeance. Disputes and conflict between the families is a primary focus while neighboring city-states are on the rise. The wealth of the city has drawn the eyes of foreign interests wanting their own share.

While the families utilize small personal armies to conduct their wars of personal vindication with each other, they have relatively small armies to defend their cities. Here the companies of mercenary warriors known as the Ventura have played a vital role. Following years of conquest in foreign lands, mercenaries returning form companies for hire, waging the wars between cities that the families cannot. The families can, however, supply the coin to fuel this constant struggle for power in the city-states while growing their personal empires.

This is Valorous Dominion

Valorous Dominion is an online role-playing experience in an alternative setting based roughly on the northern Italian city-states in the proto-renaissance period; roughly the mid 14th Century. We are a mix of the King Arthur Pendragon RPG for characters and our own system for house management and growth.

Connect: 71.171.93.80:1510
Wiki: http://valorous.wikidot.com

We’re narrowing down time to open to the scale of weeks here, started out as undefined months when we dusted off the code from Realms.

As mentioned last week, we really focused on Vindicti (formal vendetta) over this past week. In the end we’ve concluded it would work best as a formal ‘event’ entered between two houses. A challenge issue/accepted system that will be monitored through the code to allow communication between Heads of the Houses and Staff as needed. At any time two houses start to argue/fight (You sir are a codfish, you ma’am are a spendthrift, I invoke Vindicti, Concurred), one makes the challenge, the other accepts. At that point, within the system they are each awarded 1 attempt of vindication. Once per week, they may submit an attempt including a log or logs. Whether that is an honorable duel, a social slander, some chicanery, some attempt to poison the other house, or user defined form of vindication, they get one attempt for the week. The only caveat is that killing is not acceptable, so even poison its more a sick, with most likely a time to RP recover (get an antidote, hire a special physician, etc.).

If one succeeds in the attempt, the targeted house then gains another attempt to exact revenge/vindication. Only one attempt may be made in any given week. If both succeed, each house gets another attempt. A house may choose not to use the attempt and let it expire, once all attempts have failed or are expired the vendetta is ended. However, this may continue for an uncertain amount of time. Once a Vindicti expires both houses will gain reputation commensurate with the total number of successes accumulated during the formal feud over its duration. Full award to the victorious house, marginal award for the losing house. This will, thankfully, not conclude as the traditional feuds of the time did; no tower houses will be torn down and destroyed.

Logs will be required. Logging is not necessary to play Valorous Dominiom, participating in Vindicti is not necessary to RP here as well. Houses are a supplement that will hopefully drive RP, we’re viewing them something like factions and those willing to be the heads of houses are akin to faction heads. A little more will be required as such, as we expect this to help drive RP for those in and around active houses. Again, the focus is away from PK, death will result in negative outcomes for PCs that kill. This system will be monitored, as success is subjective, likewise if they seem to grow with no possible end, total time limit may be set to force expiration of the Vindicti.

That said, we’ve delved deeper into theme. The main faiths of the game are well underway, as is general history of the world and of our fair city. We’re turning towards neighboring kingdoms and city-states. While all of this is generally done, just adding a little more depth to give options for things previously mentioned, including politics and local NPCs that can act towards or react against the thrust of our primary city. Plots that will affect the city as a whole are in the works for launch shortly after opening as well.

Going forward, we’ll code up the Vindicti system in conjunction with +jobs. We will finalize valor (our version of Glory) and how it is gained along with how to use it for personal improvement. We are looking at both valor gained and time on for personal improvement (a specified amount of improvement per season or month even).

@Thenomain said in Difference between an NPC and a Staff PC?:

A mage, a werewolf, and a vampire walk into a plot. What happens next tells us a lot.

You can only take one to the bar at a time by crossing the floor. If you leave the werewolf with the vampire, the werewolf stakes them, if you leave the vampire with the mage, the vampire drains them. How do you get all three to the bar.

@Carex said in The Dark Side of online Role-Playing:

None of us ever died or got kidnapped or had anything bad happens to us just because we were outside in the world.

Speak out of your own ignorance. We entered a falstaff brewery, my friend fell off a metal later and landed on a pipe. The rest of us watched as his sucking chest wound made fucked up noises and we waited for him to be airlifted out of that abandoned building. Shut the fuck up in your ignorance, your experience isn't the same for everyone else.

I don't know my reputation and if it has any worth. I've been pretty silent this last year and have greatly reduced the amount of time I actually RP in Mu* format. That said, from my perspective I just see this as continuous dog piling on Admin like somethings going to change. The will of the people looks like an attempted bullying of the few. from my perspective.

I disagree with @Derp's sentiments often enough, I don't like everything I've seen from them. @Ganymede's doesn't agree either, we've all seen them go back and forth themselves in disagreement (those of us reading all the threads have seen them quip at each other). I respect Gany's decision to bring in a voice of opposition to moderate in fairness (akin to presidents bringing in bi-partisan folks to their cabinets for broader voice).

Some of the banned folks I know, some I only know from here.

What I see is the attempted voice to shut down the mod's decisions in what has the appearance of several cliques trying to get their way; again I know some of the folks banned and I know its not a self aware clique just the appearance of such. In all honestly, some of this group this is the exact same group that got a prior admin ousted (I don't recall if they stepped down or if it was discussed with other admin to quill the dog pile). I know that person completely left the Mu* part of their RP hobby after that a few years back. I know they're doing good now avoiding the Mu* world.

However, agree/disagree with someone, it was a dog pile then and it is an attempted dog pile now and it gives the perception of a clique, and I mean it in a negative connotation. I don't like what Derp says half the time, but I don't see them maliciously going after folks to have them banned or using their 'authority' for some undo persuasion or favors or something else untoward. I respect the current bans (possibly temporary) to get a hand on the initial dumpster fire, and I see the continued support for the banned group as just throwing fuel into the fire but serving little other purpose aside from making the fire bigger.

I respect the decisions made by moderators leading up to this point. I respect what Gany has said, they'll review it when @mietze returns for some clarity. Gany has been nothing but honest from all I have seen. But this continued pouring of gasoline into the dumpster fire is really painting more of this impression of the clique. I see people speaking up against it in quiet voices worried of being banned (in posts that seem nothing like the initial posts and do not warrant banning) -- but they've already said they'd review it. I still see some of the initial bans as part of the problem that drove a prior moderator out of this aspect (Mu*ing) of the hobby, and it has the perception doing the same again.

I trust Gany to do as they said, review when things simmer down. Can we get there without more gas going into the fire?

I didn't see it until I saw it.

An active social media type place on-line where folks could discuss things with civility. The Ares discord folks are pretty civil and they have an impressive group of folks there. Its, as one would guess, focused on running Ares games mostly. However in the early years of its existence I remember Theno quietly leaving from here but continuing over there in discourse related to ideas such as game running. I'm sure at times @faraday felt like it was a bit of disagreement. But the two could express their opinions without it devolving as it has done here in the past. While disagreeing, it felt healthy. I like to believe its possible.

@tooters said in Liberation MUSH: One Month Review:

But that's the problem with 20-30 person scenes: not just here, but I have been MUSHing for 20+ years and NEVER have seen it done where everyone has fun. So it's not just this particular situation. A smarter decision would have been to break it up, even if you have to do it on multiple days.

I had to steal this out of another thread. I almost put it in the RL friendly thread as it seems good advice, but then I figured why not put it here. This is sound advice. Big scenes don't work. I know some folks like larger scenes, but I think there's a critical mass for any plot type scene.

It sort of goes hand in hand with pondering the RL friendly question but how to support numbers of players within plot architecture. Currently I do like the trend in seeing lots more smaller games that can focus on smaller groups of players to do more plot. Its in the range of step up from TTG. My ideal TTG is 5 players if I'm being honest, so I can give everyone attention at my table. If I get more players at a table, I've a longtime GM friend that will co-GM with me, we've been at it long enough players probably think we read each others minds.

Just rambling, but what is a good critical mass for major plot like scene/event? Aside from as many as the runner can handle, is there some ratio of player to staff that works/doesn't work?

@apos said in Hello MSBites! Grade your administrators.:

@lotherio I think that was more because saying I mischaracterized an argument is similar to saying someone was disingenuous, so if the latter is an insult then the former would be also. I think this underscores that it is difficult to talk about this stuff in a civil way that doesn't spiral.

It is very understandable that any accusation of not doing work or that their creations are derivative is insulting and unfair. I really think that sort of thing is unnecessary and very unfair to creators, and you and Faraday in particular do tremendous work, but it is also extremely difficult to talk about any of this in a way that someone doesn't take personally.

I am not in all threads. Just someone saying 'I was called disingenuous' with a reply of 'literally what' reads in straight forward context as the reply being confounded that someone was insulted by being called disingenuous. I don't have the full context of course.

And of course to further the point of how these things lead to dumpster fires, in comes jokes about genitals and mocking what is insulting and mud-slinging. Like, in a few pages, there will be popcorn gifs to help further illustrate the slippery slope that is being discussed.

Jade Crossing is the way between worlds, connecting Earth to the Jade Valley. During times of high magic the Bridges and Tunnels between worlds are open and magic flows high on Earth. Magic, however, has been in slumber for generations.

Yet - Crossings have been breached between other dimensions. A phenomenon known as Night Terrors is ongoing. Sightings of little monsters; faded shots on YouTube, jokes by news anchors. Similar to trends like clown sightings or the Chupacabra, its believed to be a hoax by most people. You know otherwise. It has awakened something in you, like magic and you've encountered the Night Terrors. What this means for you and the threat to the barrier that protects earth from other dimensions, the Jade Crossing, is a tale that has only just begun.

Jade Crossing is a new MUSH focused on urban/contemporary fantasy. In a manner it is similar to a year-one comic/powered story line. Individuals have powers and they are trying to figure out why. There are villains and secret organizations out there working against the heroes, but at this point it is unknown. Plenty of room for Player Run Plots as we progress both on Earth and in the Realms beyond.

Please feel free to check things out: http://jadecrossing.wikidot.com
Address: arcadia.silvertree.org:1338

Friday Update

Politics/House management system is well under way. Presently setting the data for additions to Houses, it will plug into the ability for heads to purchase them based on their current commodities and the cost of said addition. Each addition is relative to one non-combat skill, everyone in said house nets a bonus when using that skill. Similar to the family bonus in CG in traditional Pendragon, but something to achieve as a house. Each house is set to a specific commodity it can produce, but Heads can assign a secondary administrative individual to try to gain secondary commodities. With this ability in player hands, we have no idea what the final commodity values wil be; if every house prefers one type of secondary administrator, that commodity will be devalued. Not in staff hands. This should be done in a few days, including the ability for Heads to trade with other houses.

Once that is done, we will turn heavily towards flushing out more theme and may possible start prepping for a soft open.

Things in the hopper:

Patronage for houses; the ability to hire non-noble professionals to net additional bonuses to the use of non-combat skills; will require having an appropriate addition. Individuals will have a set ‘income’. Houses will have a set level of wages to distribute based on level of nobility; they could set someone as a marshal for their house and pay them however much they think they are worth. Can be martial/combative or could be non-combative to gain the patronage bonuses. If both this and additions prove popular, we do plan to offer a secondary state to patron: tutelage, or full time retainer/employment. With tutelage, a second stage of upgrades for the additions would potentially become available (its in our thoughts, but dependent on the play after the game opens).

Individual economy. Spending on professionals/crafts-persons nets glory for the spender and for the professional; buy a high quality work of art, both individual and crafts-person gain glory (glory can be used to enhance individual skills/attributes/etc. in the end). Combative types can spend it on better combat equipment (high end armor/better mounts/etc.).

Plot/Adventure system. Initially we intended to dole out missions via objects/packages similar to the missions on Realms, where instead of staff giving the guidelines for challenges and such its on the package/+job-like system/etc. This will still happen, but there will be house level plots. These will be more political oriented – woo the foreign powers, woo the pope, convince the Byzantium Emperor to let your family house his brother while in political exile (secret bonus for killing him off, negative modifier if you recognized this from the showtime series), convince the roving mercenaries to not attack your tower in the raid but the other houses, etc. etc. Some of these will most likely be competitive style between houses; compete in some context with other houses get the ear of the Byzantium Emperor to get the wooing package adventure, or otherwise compete to get the plot to then work for the reward it has to offer. These adventure/plots will come with various prizes as well. Bonus to house reputation, a bonus addition that may not be listed or bought, influence in a specific sphere that can be cashed in later when/if needed or open up other potential adventures.

That’s the basics, House system nearing completion. Plans to implement Patronage, personal economies, and plot/adventure system expanded to include package and adventures for houses.

A lot of focus on the play and development of the houses for now. The building of additions is slow to gain various reputation and modifiers to PC skills; a prolific house can potentially add one addition every couple of months (there are over 30 additions not including public works); coupled with Patronage and house adventures/plots, there is more competition to gain other rewards outside of the building system. Houses will not start with a focus specialty as in KAP basic CG, but can earn these for all their members through development and play.

We’re about to delve deeper into theme in the next few days on this. Just an update, again.

@faraday said in Space Games and Travel Time? Why? Why Not?:

You go down that rabbit hole and pretty soon you're talking a fully integrated economy/space/weapons system. There's nothing wrong with that, but these systems need to be in balance somehow.

This here. Agreed, nothing wrong with this. If you go down the rabbit hole, see where it goes! Make it good and make it balanced, but make it the focus, the big picture, the draw. If one's doing all that work, bring it center stage. Leave RP as an ancillary thing to do when one isn't transporting cargo, upgrading their ship,, evading Imperials as a 'smuggle and evade minigame', or calculating the cost of the spice melange on Arrakis following a fremen uprising (and yes, if you're doing space trade, have things like this affect it all somehow). Make it a good simulation of space, don't tack it on to an RPG set in space because you want it. For me, there's plenty of other space strategy games out there for me to get my fix that I don't care much for it when I seek RP; but I do love some good space travel/trading/mining/federation/etc games.

Just for ponderance; what about a minigame that supports the main emphasis of storytelling?

Sort of what @Thenomain may have been getting at by referencing combat as a minigame, one they may not like buy in essance a side element of a MU that some people enjoy or look forward too. If the emphasis on a MU is action oriented story telling with a great combat system (minigame) to add combat on the fly in a manner that doesn't rely on splat books and rules/mechanics knowledge that otherwise slows down game play, does the minigame of combat and maximizing for combat in anyway detract from or add to the action oriented story telling focus?

I like @pyrephox's idea of the farming minigame. This could seem like a distraction, but what if the main focus of the Mu* is on home building and social drama, where the better the garden is just something that helps further story telling, friendly competition between houses, or friendly focus between friends to make a good garden together?

I was seeing correlation between the farming minigame and the house building emphasis we're working on after that post. The house building is more a minigame really, but it adds to the house dominion/dynasty aspect of the story telling we're after right now. Whether its bragging about the house, or being better in some realm of play, its meant to tie in with the story focus overall; similar to individual char sheet and netting XP or Skill gains or some other form of mechanical character growth. Its not needed, I've enjoyed plenty of MUs with no systems or coded combat or character sheets.

I absolutely get the minigame as a deterrent that can absolutely take away focus from RP and story telling. I played SW1 for years, where most people idled on ships all day to do the trade minigame for in-game credit to buy more coded machines (swoop building machines, trade machines, shipyards, ships, etc.) all driven by a game economy that was great stuff but detracted from RP aspects quite often (it could benefit RP and story telling, but more often than not it had PCs idling for hours at a time to get more loot).

Just, 'mini'game could mean an aspect of gameplay that is not necessarily essential to playing on a Mu* but can contribute to the story telling focus?

@mr-johnson said in Tenuous Tie-In or Original Universe?:

It makes it a lot easier to get into because you don't need to comb the wiki beginning to end in order to understand what you're getting into.

I think a lot of folks share the sentiment for worlds they are familiar with, but I want to offer the opposite end of the spectrum. I'm through with cannon verse when I'm looking for a new place to play. I might be familiar with Star Wars in having seen the films and avidly playing WEG SW in the 80s and 90s, but any place now I have zero interest in because canon includes X number of books from the literature, Y number of games, Z number of TV series, etc. Sure they have some hodge podge guide saying what is/isn't cannon, but its usually more than I care to learn. Instead of SW with this, minus that, mix the other, I'd just be as happy with space opera game Delta, evil tyrant, conflicting races/civilizations, and some nod to the tech level to help with things as pointed out (space ships travel so fast, teleportation works, neural networking doesn't or whatever). Aliens verse has just as much culture in its cannon, numerous movies, comics, other sources. Could even be 'our technology is like canon universe, but instead we've ... Just, make sure the 'comparison' is something popular enough that people understand it.

For me, it is much easier to read original theme then to try and get caught up on a wealth of cannon that I either had no time to get into since the inception of the canon universe or wasn't interested enough and won't be to play a MU. Then again, I'm more after storytelling when I play and I appreciate the creativity of an original world over canon MU/game. And with original theme, I know if I ask the main creator of theme a question that wasn't in the files/wiki, they'll have an answer that isn't 'we must check the cannon' or some long explanation of how the canon conflicts and then a determination of how the joint is going to deal with that question.

That said, either is good, canon-verse or original theme, just different stroke and different folks.

One of the last things we're working out is Valor. Valor replaces glory for Valorous Dominion; simply because Glory has a large tie to chivalry. Valor is very similar, fame and reputation, status and standing, gossip in the shadows and glory on the lute of musicians. But, it's not really chivalrous. Vendetta is a large part of daily life for the nobility, and thus courage to act and defend honor is a sign of valor. Likewise, it is reputation. Doesn't have to come from good deeds; best example I can think of is Cersei Lannister's walk of shame. It may have been humiliating, but her courage to do it or her gumption to do it in spite of everything might have bolstered her reputation from the event.

House management and Vindicti are systems in place. One of the uses of house commodities is to hold social events, sporting events, tournaments and the like. Not only is this a way to impress/turn the ear of NPCs of influence, it is a way to increase house reputation. We are focusing less on combat (it's there) as a means to gain Valor, this concept is similar to hosting tournaments in Pendragon. The net 'glory' is instead awarded to the house as reputation. Individuals that attend the party gain 1/10th that reputation as personal valor. It will mirror the levels of glory for tournaments, with a progression for importance of the event; one can raise the level by attracting influential/famous NPCs to the event. The easiest way to get an NPC to show up is spending of house or personal reputation to draw them to the gathering, increasing the reputation for the house to host such notable individuals and, thereby, increasing personal valor for being in attendance at prestigious events. We're hoping a lot of the drive to gain and earn valor is player driven.

Another implementation post-opening we are planning is a quirk/hook/goal system. We're not requiring any of these for characters, but those wishing to add them and play them out will be rewarded. Our focus in the system is on houses, anything we don't see is something we won't know about. Using this system will prevent reliance on +requests to earn Valor, but like all systems it will take effort and this will require logging on some level to supply to the system as proof of goals. Rather than define levels of goal/quirk/hook involvement, it will be by the month and the amount of scenes/etc in which the goal is worked on or the hooks played out. No matter how many listed, there will be a limit of Valor awarded per month.

All that said, we are settling on an opening of Monday (23rd). It's a full opening and we're sure there are plenty of things missed or overlooked. It will come with changes, code fixes, theme clarifications and anything in between. Once we open it will be a persistent setting for the characters developing. We could call it alpha, but even if anything needs fixed changed, the characters, there will be little cosmetic difference as the story persists.