Posts made by ThatGuyThere

@faraday said in Finding roleplay:

@Lotherio said in Finding roleplay:

I was with the definition, my gripe was more about not liking scheduling, approval, and getting staff involved (to approve or to reward) but now I think I'm with @Thenomain and those the days before 'PrP's ...

But that's the thing... even back in 1996 we had TPs run by players. On some games (Maddock) it was free-for-all where you could run whatever you wanted, and on other games (B5) there was a +tpview system where everything had to be submitted and approved and it tied into a events notification system if there was a scheduled date... did I miss the "good old days" somehow?

Might be another of those genre things. i played on or at least poked my head in as a guest on pretty much every WoD game in the mid-90s(93-97) and on them it was mostly what Theno has already described a bunch of players together, sometimes with preexisting relationship some times just as strangers deciding hey lets do something. Sometimes it lead to other things sometimes it was as simple as the bar we were in getting robbed and everyone trying to figure out how to stop it with out revealing what you were, none of them were ever really scheduled in advance.
Now sometimes if you had an IC pack/coterie/cabal etc you would then take turns planing out things as well which is really more similar to what I think of as a PrP in the usage I normally hear it.

Edit to avoid double post: I humbly suggest we use the term Pick up scene to describe the old days thing, much like a pick up game of basketball you played with whomever was at the court and looking for fun.
So with the help of lat term. I really do agree that PrPs are good and necessary and quite often fun but boy I have to admit I sure do miss the old days where Pick up scenes were easy to find for when you wanted something crunchier then social.

I look at Preacher like I look at Sin City, any time I can get Frank Miller style stories without Frank Miller art it is a plus. or Garth Ennis style with out actually Garth Ennis writing I am on board.
Besides his Swamp Thing run, which is second only to the Alan Moore run for awesome Swamp Thing, my opinion of Ennis is always I like the ideas but the execution not so much.

Sadly the games that are more permissive on running things these days are also the ones that offer nothing I am remotely interested in playing.

@faraday said in Finding roleplay:

@Thenomain said in Finding roleplay:

@ThatOneDude said in Finding roleplay:

But if you don't go to events, what do you do in RP?

Rescue damsels, fight monsters, spend my loot on ale and whores. The same kinds of things that you do during events, only without the pressure that we're on a time crunch and that the Plot Must Be Resolved.

Ummm.... how is that different from a PrP? Seems to fit the textbook definition to me? Not nitpicking, just genuinely curious since you seem to be so anti-PrP.

Can't speak for Theno but where what he is talking about differs from a PrP in one very significant way, lack of having to jump through hoops etc, in the bygone days you could easily be sitting around with folks or even strangers and say hey everyone feel like some action. If folks agreed pull out some random antagonists and has the action, if folks gelled playing style wise turn i into a regular thing.

The more modern PrP even at places that are very permissible with them requires having a clear idea of what the plot will be before hand, often clearing of the possible antagonists nameless they are nameless mooks and logging of the scenes which is not really a hoop but a pain as I don't log normally and have to make a point to remember to do so. True this days you also get extra rewards/XP for participating and running in them, but I preferred to be able to just throw stuff out on the fly and wing it.

Edit to Add: And this is a lesson to read the whole thread before posting, Coin and Theno both basically answered the same thing I did before me and better then me.

Even though the conversation has moved on a little as a Twolves fan I feel the need to comment on them.
Will the be a thing in a couple years? That defines what you mean by a thing. I think they will reach hte level of playoff regular, which will be nice to return to. If you mean serious title contender then I don't see it. I hope I am wrong about this but honestly I see us more growing into the Atlanta Hawks role, playoffs every year, sometimes making noise there or even getting serious contender buzz but never making the Finals.
This would be a repeat of the Garnett glory years pretty much and I am happy with that I will gladly take playoffs and one trip to the WCF over the years we have had since Garnett went to Boston and even the few before that.
Not sure how I feel about the hiring of Thibs, I don't question his basketball IQ, or tactical coaching ability but do have concerns about his player management skills. Still I hope for the best.
And to needle Gany, odd but true stat, the Toronto Raptors are now 0-9 in playoff openers.

@Wolfs
The Spurs are great this year no mistake. I think any other year in resent memory they would be favorites for the title, however Golden State is having a historically great year, one with a valid argument for best ever.
As a basketball fan, I really want to see them in the Western Conference finals against each other.
My prediction for that is a wonderful series that will be a joy to watch, and Warriors in six. (Note I would be cheering for the Spurs in this match up but Curry is just so on this year it is scary.)

Sadly I would not be surprised if this was Tim Duncan's last ride.
I do not want this to be the case but I think we have at most of two years more to enjoy him.

From a purely player perspective I would prefer Library or whatever Advanced rather then Advanced whatever mainly because in use I pull up my sheet to get a quick look at a particular stat I have, and my mind would think Library and look in the Ls before it would thing Advanced and look in the As and if I had multiple Advanced merits having a bunch of Advanced blah rows would make things more difficult to mentally sort. Admittedly I have not read Beast yet so no clue if multiple advanced Merits are allowed or possible.
As far as the extra typing, yes that is a pain but it is not really the code's fault more so the source material's.

If the settlements were all within walking distance I would consider them the same place.
Kind of like how suburbs of major cities tend to get considered part of the city even when though they are separate legal entities.
Yeah if there is no significant distance between them I don't see and issue with different neighborhoods as a way of organizing the player base.

@Misadventure
For me the difference between splitting spheres and splitting locations, is I can still easily rp with folks in different spheres. Take Fallcoast for example, if nothing is going on my my sphere I can rp social things with others or even small scale PrPs I have been in a couple where the other PCs were mortal and had fun with my character not using powers for the IC fear of being discovered but still getting to contribute to a story and have fun.
Now and games where things are separated by location travel can be an issue, both with time and with theme. Time can be hand waved to a certain extant but for a zombie theme I think travel should be dangerous, but If I am +meetme'd to the neutral area every couple of days for rp then travel is not really dangerous on an IC level. Since ICly my character would be traveling back and forth fairly willy nilly.

For the star I would say two sites with contested resources could work but four seems like a lot right away.

I am not sure you want to start out with four separate settlements.
My concern is that it will likely splinter the player base and make finding rp harder especially in the very important early days when you are trying to build a player base.

@deadculture
I don't argue those two points.
Though I can see that we are both two entrenched ot make further discussion have a point and sicne we are not in the hog pit I will withdraw from the thread.

@bored
Hey the goal posts did not move. You named a game that fit them. Congrats you scored.
I am quite happy to stipulate Star crusade as an example of the games you have been supporting.

As for most games being closer to Star Crusade then not all I can say is thank goodness in my experience they are not.

@Roz said:

(I think the worst was daring to say I didn't really think Joss Whedon's stuff was as feminist as he likes to claim.)>

I know way off the topic but Joss Whedon''s stuff is feminist? I have never seen that at all, though I am speaking as a guy.

I would argue on Star Crusade but I will give it to you.
I am not taking my ideas on Star Crusade from Cirno's trolling but from my experiences there.
Star Crusade had rules that changed on a monthly basis on some things, staff that freely admitted after the fact they told people different OOC versions of "the truth" to create friction both the IC and OOC kind, (IC friction good, OOC friction bad.), and a chargen and advancement system so broken that how effective you were depended almost entirely on who got your app. Now I got lucky and had a statistical bad ass but I had multiple people show me their sheet which were pretty gimped, and the pace of advancement was glacial for if oyu got gimped in cgen you stayed gimped. Now to your points I did have a few adventures but all in all found less plot RP then I am finding at Fallcoast.
Honestly Bored if that is what you consider a positive example of anything we are far too far apart for further discussion to have meaning.
Though I do hope you find nothing but games like Star Crusade in your future, yake that as either blessing or a curse whichever you prefer.

@bored
Not a sandbox and not about relationships. So it would simply be one that had mostly staff plots and a majority of the rp was not focused on relationships.

@bored
Not every game ever in fact I can name plenty that weren't but I am talking about now.
If I am so uninformed and wrong name one from the past decade.
Also I see nothing wrong with relationship simulators or sand boxes you seem to be the one with a negative attitude towards them. I am simply saying that is what exists. And likely they exist because that is what people prefer.
As far as Packrat's proposed game. I wish him the best of luck but based one the one other game I have seen him staff, Star Crusade, I know what I think it is likely to become.
I played at Star crusade, it had a lower ratio of plot scenes to social scenes then most of the sandboxes I have seen.

@bored
My point is that in the last decade I have only heard of two places that managed that sort of sustained effort.
The Reach leading up to an during the End of the World plot and RfK.
You keep responding with it being possible. I agree however given the current mush demographics which you mention , I am saying I will believe in it happening when I see it.

@bored
Not saying Staffers do market research but regardless of the ability of staff to do less work if people did not enjoy PrP based games they would not play on them.
Market forces exist whether people are paying attention to them or not.
And no correlation does not necessarily equal causation but it is generally seen to imply a connection.
RfK worked and got people involved mainly through the work of Shava not just the systems and staff work but also in paging people to bring plots that would fit their character to their attention. She would introduce people on channel and by page whose characters would play well off each other things like that. I am not saying it cannot be done but it takes a shit ton of work from dedicated people. Who do you propose would be the Shava of this game? You volunteering for that role?
Not to be insulting but if his behavior on the channels on SC is inductive of his personality Appolonius is not particularly suited for it.
RfK did a lot of things right, but it was run by someone who really attempted to run the game as a GM would a table top and it was wonderful, it also grew way too damn big to survive on that model. Unless you have someone like Shava willing to dedicate themselves to the game I don't think it is a viable model to follow.

tl-dr summary It takes personal interaction not systems to change the culture, find the person to do that and you will have a chance of changing the culture. Without that person you really do not.

@bored
And sandbox games out number plot intensive games in the modern market. There is a reason for that, well more then one most likely. Though one that I think people over look is maybe a majority of players prefer it that way.

@lordbelh
I believe the folks playing decide what the game is about. true you can do many things in the lords and ladies settings. As I stated earlier mine would be adventuring using the setting as a back drop. Essentially John Carter the MUSH, but that is not what L+L mushes are about. Everyone I have seen in the past decade has been roughly 70 percent marriage simulator/ who is banging who sorts of things, around 25 percent politics / empire building and the remaining 5 percent adventure-y stuff.
Does it have to be? No not at all but until one is made I will continue to say that is what they are about.
Has it always been this way? Again no, but the purposed game would be made today not then.